Big Ring or small Ring ?

davibbain72

I'm almost completely new to Road cycling, having only got my bike 8 weeks ago. I have been increasing my mileage as the weeks have gone by, and have done over 50 miles a couple of times.

Anyway, my question is this:-

I went for a run with a small group of cyclists yesterday, and was asked by one of them whether I always ride the "Big ring". I am assuming that this was not a come on, and was in fact a cycle related question but in all honesty didn't really know what he meant.

This got me thinking as to my cycling style (if you can call it a style). I tend to stick it onto the "Big ring", and my lowest (?) gear when on the flat, and only move up through the gears when climbing any hills. Is this the correct manner of cycling, or should I be looking to come up a couple of gears when on the flat (and just pedal harder/faster) and only come down onto the lowest gear when descending (I have found that when descending I tend to run out of gears). I cannot think of any occassion where I have dropped down onto my small ring at the front, even during climbing.

Any advice / help would be welcome.

sungod

do what you're comfortable with

some general things to consider...

a higher cadence puts less stress on joints, so needlessly mashing too high a gear may be unwise long term

cross-chaining, using the largest couple of sprockets on the cassette when in the big ring puts more stress on the drive chain, so it can wear faster, it's also less efficient

shifting between big/small rings on the 3rd largest sprocket let's you keep cadence up, then as things get steeper you can shift to bigger sprockets as required, not grind to a halt on the big ring and then make a graunching change from an extreme position

typically the most efficient cadence is in the 70s, but people often choose a higher cadence 90-ish as it reduces stress on the legs (shifting it to the heart/lungs which can recover quicker) and allows faster acceleration

etc. blah blah blah

dj58

I think he was hinting that you may not be using your transmission in the most efficient manner.
What sungod said is good advice, experiment a bit with your gear combinations.

davibbain72

Thanks for the replies. It's something I never really thought about. I just assumed that the big / small combination supplied the most power in everything other than climbing, but this has opened my eyes a bit. Will get out (hopefully tomorrow) and have a wee experiment

ForumNewbie

Unless you live and ride in a very flat area, I'd be surprised if you have never needed to drop to the small chain ring at the front. Hills will be an almighty struggle sticking in the big ring.

JayKosta

Try to become comfortable pedaling at an rpm that does not require etreme force on the downstroke, and which allows you to easily move the pedals in smooth 'circles'.
Doing excessive 'hard pedaling' will eventually cause serious knee troubles.

For the majority of riding, keep the chain on the 'central' rear gears, and learn how to use the front chainwheel gears for higher speed (the big gear), and climbing hills (the small gear). For max speed use the big front and small rear. For easiest hills use small front and large rear.

Jay Kosta
Endwell NY USA

StillGoing

ForumNewbie wrote:

Unless you live and ride in a very flat area, I'd be surprised if you have never needed to drop to the small chain ring at the front. Hills will be an almighty struggle sticking in the big ring.

Plenty of riders spend more time in the small ring where they can spin a high 100+rpm cadence rather than the big ring.

CiB

Your bike has a range of gears from easy to pedal but slow, to hard but faster. 20 gears = about 14/15 different ratios, most of which are legitimate gears except for the big ring to big cog & small ring to small cog (cross-chaining) as explained earlier. Other than avoiding cross-chaining use whatever suits, but the bloke who asked had a legit point if you're beetling along in big ring big cog. Using the small ring & middle gears is better as you have an immediate higher & lower gear to hand and tbh it doesn't make you look like a novice. Cadence-wise mid-80s is a nicer figure to aim for than 70s or 90 until it becomes your new norm, and once you learn to spin faster it'll become clear why spinning a bit faster is better than grinding at the bottom of the range. Pedalling faster in a lower gear is more effective, more efficient and easier to keep up than grinding away in a bad choice of gear that only offers faster wear on chain & knees.

Mikey23

After 12k over 2 years I'm just beginning to realise this... My cadence is now up from 70 to 80 average and my riding is better because of it...

DesB3rd

No one's mentioned gearing; which the OP doesn't mention!

A standard (53) chainring w. a tight cassette will need >17mph to hold big ring at a decent (cadence (say 85+rpm, no cross-chaining ); compact w. wide-cassette (e.g. 12-28) more like 14mph. It doesn't sound a lot but for a newish rider in a relatively flat area you're going from "some of the time" to "almost all the time."

StillGoing

I'm not new to riding but will spend most of my time in the small ring spinning around 100-110rpm using the 14 and a compact set up. That gives me a rough speed of 20mph on the flat and allows me to gear down when the road goes up without messing with the front. If the road goes downhill or there's an opportunity for higher speed, I then use the front to move into the big ring but the changes on the front are far less by using the small ring and a high cadence than the big ring and a lower cadence.

cougie

Why deliberately not use the small ring and take out half of your gear ratios ?

The OP sounds like he's grinding away everywhere and has no ability to spin if he runs out of gears on the descents.
(which must mean he struggles massively if the hill is steep enough to spin out - but he's climbing in the big ring).

Count your cadence. Watch the pros - they will pedal about 80rpm. I bet you're more like 60.

markhewitt1978

I'm nearly always sticking in the big ring, partly because it's a challenge to myself to keep the gearing high to see if I can do it, but of course that results in cross-chaining .

Part of it was that front shifting was such a chore with my 105 set, getting back into the big ring was always a tussle, now I've upgraded to Ultegra it's easy so I'm going to have to make a point of using the little ring instead of going big-big.

CiB

cougie wrote:

Why deliberately not use the small ring and take out half of your gear ratios ?

That's what I often wonder, why avoid using something that's there for a purpose? To my mind gears are gears and there's no reason not to use some ratios for whatever reason. Spinning at mid to high 80s cadence and above is the same in the 39-15 as it is in the 53-20 (made-up numbers, pls don't bother arguing the general point...). The only reason to use one over the other is errr... maybe there's a climb coming up and it'll save half a second not changing down to the 39, or ummm, there's a descent ahead it'll save time being in the big ring ahead of it.... altho it takes no more time to change at the rings as it does at the cassette so any time gain is slim to the point of non-existent.

Your bike has a nice spread of ratios, some of which are duplicates but none are hard to find and use. Why wouldn't you? It also spreads the wear so the 3rd new chain on your original gear set doesn't jump on the gears that you routinely avoid using.

lastwords

When I keep my cadence between 80 - 95 I find i ride quicker this usually means on my compact chainset I will be in the big ring most of the time, if my cadence starts to dip towards 80 I will drop it to an easier gear. I use all of the rear cassette before changing down to the small chain ring with no adverse affects.

Its alright spinning all the time because its efficient but if you want to get stronger legs at some point you need to push some big gears. Variety is what's needed.

I suppose there are a lot of different answers to this topic as everyone is different and has different goals.

vermin

Maybe OP has a compact, or even a CX, big ring coupled with a 28 or 30 low sprocket. If I didn't mind a spot of chain crossing, which I don't, it would take a pretty big hill to bother me into the small ring. That said, the new e-gears make me want to jump chainrings just for fun now.

But yes, he was probably just flirting with you.

norvernrob

Concentrating on upping my cadence made the biggest difference to my riding yet, it needs a little thought at first but soon becomes second nature.

Riding becomes easier and your speeds will improve, there are no prizes for trying to push the big ring all the time. I did a sportive on Sunday and it was hilarious how many people had literally no idea how to ride up hills, so many of them were out of the saddle grinding a big gear but getting nowhere whilst I span past them.

All pushing a big gear all the time gets you is sore muscles.

mathrees

All very interesting.

So as a complete novice would you advocate using the small ring on the front and a "mid" gear on the back and spinning as comfortable as possible?

Then if a hill comes stay in the saddle (depending on the gradient) and spin it up, and if a steeper gradient get out of the saddle?

lastwords

If you have just started cycling just get out and ride try to go a little bit further each time.

As for gears to start with I would just ride in whatever gear you feel comfortable using to begin with.

Spinning an easier gear will put more stress on you cardiovascular system and pushing in a hard gear will put more strain on your muscular system the trick is to train both. You need to use the gears on the bike according to the terrain / gradient you are riding and taking into consideration what you are trying to achieve, forget about staying in the small ring on the front and a "mid" gear on the back.

Eg. Say I decided to go on a ride where I wanted to work on my muscular strength. I would stay in the hardest gear that allowed me to stay above 80rpm cadence.

imposter2.0

davibbain72 wrote:

I just assumed that the big / small combination supplied the most power in everything other than climbing,

Do you drive your car everywhere in top gear?

deimosjohnny

Cross-chaining was probably the reason for the question but I would ask why he asked, if you are a newbie though I would have thought he might explain. Unfortunately there is a bit of being up yourself with some cyclists.
As a newbie myself from what I have read the answer is a combination of spinning and pushing depending on whatever you are trying to achieve. If you are trying to build up muscle strength you push, if you are trying to work out cardiovascular you spin. Ultimately, getting spinning right will increase speed and stamina.

StillGoing

deimosjohnny wrote:

Cross-chaining was probably the reason for the question but I would ask why he asked, if you are a newbie though I would have thought he might explain. Unfortunately there is a bit of being up yourself with some cyclists.
As a newbie myself from what I have read the answer is a combination of spinning and pushing depending on whatever you are trying to achieve. If you are trying to build up muscle strength you push, if you are trying to work out cardiovascular you spin. Ultimately, getting spinning right will increase speed and stamina.

Not quite the reason why. A high cadence is more efficient meaning you don't use what power you have too soon. Also a low cadence could be you're pushing too big a gear risking damage to your knees.

Ringpeace

davibbain72 wrote:

I'm almost completely new to Road cycling, having only got my bike 8 weeks ago. I have been increasing my mileage as the weeks have gone by, and have done over 50 miles a couple of times.

Anyway, my question is this:-

I went for a run with a small group of cyclists yesterday, and was asked by one of them whether I always ride the "Big ring". I am assuming that this was not a come on, and was in fact a cycle related question but in all honesty didn't really know what he meant.

This got me thinking as to my cycling style (if you can call it a style). I tend to stick it onto the "Big ring", and my lowest (?) gear when on the flat, and only move up through the gears when climbing any hills. Is this the correct manner of cycling, or should I be looking to come up a couple of gears when on the flat (and just pedal harder/faster) and only come down onto the lowest gear when descending (I have found that when descending I tend to run out of gears). I cannot think of any occassion where I have dropped down onto my small ring at the front, even during climbing.

Any advice / help would be welcome.

You are definitely a big ring kinda guy!

MichaelW

In the overlap zone, you can use either ring for the same ratio. bear in mind any up-coming changes, eg uphill or downhill.
Which ring is better? Neither.
You want a gear range which is correct for YOU, not an elite professional.

opus25

I don't really focus on which gear (other than not to cross chain) - HRM and especially cadence are the guide.

When starting out last year I often saw a cadence of 90 ish recommended. Once I got a Garmin cadence sensor I saw I averaged 65-70 and thought 90 was weird at first and 100 and above felt plain crazy.

Needless to say after working on it by watching my cadence every time I rode and upping the average a each time, I was soon riding at 90-100. Now if I drop below 90 for more than a brief period, I go to an easier gear. Likewise over 110 and I go for a harder gear, often moving between big and small rings depending on ascent/descent/flat just making sure to not cross chain, which means the middle of the cassette most of the time. I use 105 and it's not a problem switching rings, especially if watching what lies ahead.

Out of the saddle and I prefer a slightly harder gear than when sat down. Not quite mastered the twinkle toes technique of Contador just yet.

If you don't drop to the small ring for climbs, either you're a great climber or didn't find a steep enough gradient yet.

gozzy

CiB wrote:

cougie wrote:

Why deliberately not use the small ring and take out half of your gear ratios ?

That's what I often wonder, why avoid using something that's there for a purpose? To my mind gears are gears and there's no reason not to use some ratios for whatever reason. .

This is what I think whenever I hear people talking about not using the inner ring on a triple. Especially when they'll happily use the same ratios on a compact.

DavidJB

In my winter base sessions I almost exclusively ride everywhere in the small ring! (39) In the summer I ride most of the time in the big ring as speed is higher (roughly the same power). As long as you're at the correct HR/Power/Cad you use the right ring for you.

meagain

Just from watching those who pass me (near enough everyone these days), I do think that quite a few are pushing (and that's a fair if imprecise description) too high a gear. Simply doesn't look efficient to me - and I can almost hear the knees grinding!

But then I rode fixed almost exclusively for 5 - 6 years until my lung capacity became insufficient, so I was never in the wrong gear, if only occasionally in the right one! Now I happily grovel in the smallest triple...