Knowingly buying fake stuff

Iamnot Wiggins

If you're old bill and there's a question mark hovering over your ethics by buying a replica, just get a family member or friend to buy it for you and then give it to you as a gift. Simples.

t4tomo

michael_roadie wrote:

Knockoffs simply say you care about brand/designer labels but are too poor to afford them, so you're trying to con others into thinking you have actually paid for the label. It's like those who wear those incredibly obviously fake D&G or Armani clothes - if you can't afford the real thing, then buy from a cheaper label. Otherwise you come across as desperate and pathetic. Same for bikes - if you want a cheap chinese frame, then get a cheap chinese frame - but don't get one that pretends to be something it's not.

Some would say overpaying by a vast amount for a garment just because it has a label attached is desperate and pathetic too

cougie

Colinthecop wrote:

Mccaria wrote:

By the way, did you ride the Oakley's down a hill at 40 mph?

I wore them skydiving.

So it was 32 feet a second when they broke. I couldn't see due to the wind rush and ended up plummeting into the ground without deploying my chute.

For the equivalent of £3.25 I was expecting more.

Yeah cos I'd really trust cheap crap sunglasses in a situation like that - what if they shattered ? I don't take risks with my eyesight. I've used Oakley since the 80s and they've not failed me yet.

Chinese frames - I might consider buying direct - but would rather pay a bit more and have comeback on a UK retailer.
Fake Pinarellos - no I wouldn't.

I think if you rode it in France you'd risk getting the bike confiscated ? They don't like fake goods over there.

pilot_pete

To the OP.

I question your integrity if you are indeed a police constable. I also question your judgement. To come on a public forum and openly suggest that buying a fake item on ebay is acceptable for a police officer raises serious concerns. Philthy3 has already given you sage advice.

You may like to read this article http://www.policemag.co.uk/updates/1603.aspx about the updating of your Code of Ethics and what your Federation Chair Steve Williams has to say about it. Infact, I'll post a quote from it for everyone.

Steve Williams, chair of the Police Federation, said that officers ‘must quite rightly be expected to deliver high standards of ethics and integrity’ and that the current oath of attestation sworn by police officers is the cornerstone of British policing and enshrines these values.

If you are still in any doubt, why not run it past your Chief Constable for comment? If you are so sure it is perfectly acceptable, especially as you have a beef about your low salary, I am sure he will find in your favour... :roll:

PP

cougie

I've been watching Line of Duty on BBC- I'm pretty sure even the dodgy coppers on there aren't stooping as low as fake Pinarellos. ;-)

Sprool

Fake? I prefer the term 'replica', there's no deceit in the transaction.

pilot_pete

The deceit is in the copying of a legitimate businesses design and property. As has been pointed out a replica would be sanctioned by the owners of the brand/ design etc and would therefore carry their name. This product has obviously not been sanctioned in any way, so it is therefore an unauthorised copy of the property of Pinarello.

By buying it and ignoring that fact and stating that you prefer the term replica makes no difference. It is a fake and if you buy it you are condoning the crime. It is exactly the same as buying stolen goods and trying to make out it is alright because you didn't know, except you do know when the X-box is only £50, cash, in a pub, from a bloke you don't know, with no documentation etc etc.

PP

Mikey1976

Pilot Pete wrote:

To the OP.

I question your integrity if you are indeed a police constable. I also question your judgement. To come on a public forum and openly suggest that buying a fake item on ebay is acceptable for a police officer raises serious concerns. Philthy3 has already given you sage advice.

You may like to read this article http://www.policemag.co.uk/updates/1603.aspx about the updating of your Code of Ethics and what your Federation Chair Steve Williams has to say about it. Infact, I'll post a quote from it for everyone.

Steve Williams, chair of the Police Federation, said that officers ‘must quite rightly be expected to deliver high standards of ethics and integrity’ and that the current oath of attestation sworn by police officers is the cornerstone of British policing and enshrines these values.

If you are still in any doubt, why not run it past your Chief Constable for comment? If you are so sure it is perfectly acceptable, especially as you have a beef about your low salary, I am sure he will find in your favour... :roll:

PP

+1000

djhermer

All i question is the OP's wise-ness in promulgating the fact he's old bill in his username. Without that he wouldn't have taken such a battering about morality and everyone would have moved on. Unless this has been set-up to see who would willingly support the illegal arms trade by buying fake Dogmas. In which case, he's a wise-guy indeed.

boogi11

I think that as long as you buy fake/replica stuff with your eyes wide open then there in no prob, ive just purchased a brand new 3k bike because I thought it was good value for money, I have also purchased a £300 pair of shoes and a genuine set of Oakley prescription glasses, all of which I would class as safety items, there is no way on gods green earth I would buy and ride a chinese frame from an unknown source. That said I also purchased this years merida team kit bibs and jersey for £27, obviously a fake, but better quality pad and sewing quality that my £70 gore bibs. Ive had fake shorts before and they lasted longer than the genuine ones?

kayakerchris

Buying fake or replica stuff is theft.

You are stealing their reputation. Suppose it breaks and somebody seesit broken, they do not know it is a replica, they assume pinarellos break.

You are stealing money from them. Pinarello support a whole army of designers, builders, engineers, floor sweepers, etc both in italy and China. Every time a fake enters the system that is one less real pinarello.

This is not to mention that if this is coming out of the back door of the factory it is a direct theft from the company.

A policeman coming onto a public board and making comments like this really does tell us a lot about the police and the institutional corruption talked about recently.

djhermer

Hi might not be a cop. I'm not a DJ.

slowbike

kayakerchris wrote:

Buying fake or replica stuff is theft.

Fake - yes
Replica - not necessarily - you can buy replica team kit that looks like the kit that the Pros wear, but doesn't cost as much as it isn't the same material, it's manufacture is authorised by those that own the copyright on design.

Just to clarify ...

slowbike

djhermer wrote:

Hi might not be a cop. I'm not a DJ.

CtCop has stated that he is a Police Officer - of course, he might not be ... he could be a fake ...

Father Faff

Slowbike wrote:

djhermer wrote:

Hi might not be a cop. I'm not a DJ.

CtCop has stated that he is a Police Officer - of course, he might not be ... he could be a fake ...

And I don't faff even though everyone says I do.

He could be an undercover cop cleverly disguising himself as a cop? We all know that undercover cops have no ethics at all!

Iamnot Wiggins

Father Faff wrote:

Slowbike wrote:

djhermer wrote:

Hi might not be a cop. I'm not a DJ.

CtCop has stated that he is a Police Officer - of course, he might not be ... he could be a fake ...

And I don't faff even though everyone says I do.

He could be an undercover cop cleverly disguising himself as a cop? We all know that undercover cops have no ethics at all!

I'm not Wiggins. Or am I...

vertigo16

Slowbike wrote:

kayakerchris wrote:

Buying fake or replica stuff is theft.

Fake - yes
Replica - not necessarily - you can buy replica team kit that looks like the kit that the Pros wear, but doesn't cost as much as it isn't the same material, it's manufacture is authorised by those that own the copyright on design.

Just to clarify ...

Just to clarify further, this is not legally theft either.

StillGoing

Slowbike wrote:

djhermer wrote:

Hi might not be a cop. I'm not a DJ.

CtCop has stated that he is a Police Officer - of course, he might not be ... he could be a fake ...

No you're right, but it is converting criminal property which is also a criminal offence.
http://www.thelawpages.com/criminal-off ... -321-7.law

Fake or unauthorised replica is copyright theft.

Colinthecop

Pilot Pete wrote:

I question your integrity if you are indeed a police constable. I also question your judgement. To come on a public forum and openly suggest that buying a fake item on ebay is acceptable for a police officer raises serious concerns.

I guess you missed the paragraph about the Oakleys. Perhaps the humour in the post passed you by...? Although if you're still confused, I can send you a link to a National Press article from 12 years ago that questions if I am indeed a Cop. So you're not the first and probably not the last.

Pilot Pete wrote:

If you are still in any doubt, why not run it past your Chief Constable for comment? If you are so sure it is perfectly acceptable, especially as you have a beef about your low salary, I am sure he will find in your favour... :roll:

I (might) work in an organisation where we are under intense public scrutiny. We have officers accused of a whole variety of offences on a daily basis. Infact we even have officers who are on methadone programs. When I rock up on my replica bike with the wrong stickers on it, do you think anyone other than you on your high horse gives a flying f*uck...? I doubt it. Oh yeah, apart from Phility3 who seems to think I'm funding illegal arms trading and drugs barons by committing theft which he later decided was theft of Copyright.

I guess that theft should have become breach of copyright. Retired Cop....? Unless he avoided work for 30 years (which some do), I can only assume he retired in the 50's. :roll:

djhermer wrote:

Hi might not be a cop. I'm not a DJ.

Of course I'm not a Cop, this is the internet.... 8)


So another question, My mate has done very well for himself. He has a handbuilt Cobra with the worlds best sounding Chevy big block 7.2L lump in it. It's even properly badged. It's not built by AC, it was built in the Midlands. Is that a very nice replica or a fake....? As the law seems to think it's perfectly legal to make a replica, as long as you don't try to pass it off as the real thing. If you build a replica and want to sell it, you have to tell the buyer it's a replica.

The analogy being, the Pinarello was advertised as a replica.

ricky1980

hands up if you have never bought fake merchandise...i can't say i have never. in this global market you cannot be certain that you are not buying fakes.

even the manufacturers are saying some retailers are passing on fake items as genuine willingly or unwittingly. so who's to be the judge of this.

but again to the point, why would you buy a replica/fake...(fake is such a terrible term. the frame by all intent and purposes is ok and perfectly functional and a lot better than the general market frames). well the answer is to be able to look and feel like one of the pros. well, if you cannot afford it then why persecute someone who has that aspiration. the person buys this frame may actually able to spend £200 on the branded clothing to match the bike, so the brand profits from otherwise nothing as the person can't afford the ultra expensive bike in the first place.

Now also consider this, a person riding a replica/fake pinarello is a person doing market for pinarello for free and if such item doesn't exist, the brand would have 1 less person exposing the branding on the streets. On this point, a person riding this bike will cause other to envy and consider purchase such a bike. when a person who has these thought that has the considered wealth to be able to afford the real deal then the brand is clearly reaping the benefit of the free marketing.

So for all those haters of replicas/fakes...you need to get off your high horses and consider the real world dynamics and the fact people can't always afford what they want. As long as people are not being lead to think this frame is a real pinarello then there are no issues.

the ad states it is a replica...so it is perfectly legitimate deal.

On the very last point, there are many open mould frames which looks like the pinarellos, so whats stopping me from getting one of those and then paint it in the same scheme as pinarello because i adore the scheme and really want it...

imitation is the best form of flattering. if people are copying something you did it means you are doing it well. protect your intellectual properties and let them copy away as they are doing free advertising for you and reaching the brand to otherwise a group of population you could not reach normally.

Sprool

^Well said ricky, I'm with you on this.
[q]So for all those haters of replicas/fakes...you need to get off your high horses and consider the real world dynamics and the fact people can't always afford what they want. As long as people are not being lead to think this frame is a real pinarello then there are no issues.[/q]

pilot_pete

Re: Knowingly buying fake stuff
by djhermer » Fri Mar 14, 2014 4:50 pm

Hi might not be a cop. I'm not a DJ.

I suggest you look at his posting history.


So Colin from Uig police station. If someone calls your HQ and points them in the direction of this thread you'd be happy because they wouldn't question your ethics as a serving constable? You reckon they wouldn't give a "flying f*ck"? You sure about that?

You have freely expressed an opinion on a public forum which brings your integrity into question. Doesn't matter about my moral high horse, it's your morals that are being questioned. I haven't sworn an oath, you have. So just to confirm, you will happily approach your superiors and run this by them to get their take to see if they give a flying f*ck before purchasing I assume? Please get the senior officer who gives you the green light to either post here or allow you to post a copy of his permission in writing, just to show us that he doesn't give a flying f*ck about a serving constable bringing his force into disrepute.

Oh, and your attempt humour about the Oakleys was clearly understood and completely irrelevant. As is your now back tracking and trying to double bluff that you aren't a policeman and that you might this or might that. It's your open statement that you think buying a fake Pinarello is acceptable. Let me remind you,

So the age old saying was true - if it's too good to be true, then it's probably too good to be true. It's not real, it's a fake.

But then I thought about it some more, a new carbon frame for £400 is probably a bargain. I mean, it may even come from the same factory as it's bigger and better cousins, It might even be the same mould or even the same carbon.... I don't know.

So yes it's a fake, but that doesn't bother me.... it still seems like a bargain.

You gonna keep diggin'?

PP

VmanF3

ricky1980 wrote:

So for all those haters of replicas/fakes...you need to get off your high horses and consider the real world dynamics and the fact people can't always afford what they want.

Nail on the head here - people can't always afford what they want. Quite frankly if you can't afford it, then you can't have it.

pilot_pete

Sprool wrote:

^Well said ricky, I'm with you on this.
[q]So for all those haters of replicas/fakes...you need to get off your high horses and consider the real world dynamics and the fact people can't always afford what they want. As long as people are not being lead to think this frame is a real pinarello then there are no issues.[/q]

Only issue is the injuries the rider of this one sustained...




PP

djhermer

Pilot Pete wrote:

Re: Knowingly buying fake stuff
by djhermer » Fri Mar 14, 2014 4:50 pm

Hi might not be a cop. I'm not a DJ.

I suggest you look at his posting history.


So Colin from Uig police station. If someone calls your HQ and points them in the direction of this thread you'd be happy because they wouldn't question your ethics as a serving constable? You reckon they wouldn't give a "flying f*ck"? You sure about that?

You have freely expressed an opinion on a public forum which brings your integrity into question. Doesn't matter about my moral high horse, it's your morals that are being questioned. I haven't sworn an oath, you have. So just to confirm, you will happily approach your superiors and run this by them to get their take to see if they give a flying f*ck before purchasing I assume? Please get the senior officer who gives you the green light to either post here or allow you to post a copy of his permission in writing, just to show us that he doesn't give a flying f*ck about a serving constable bringing his force into disrepute.

Oh, and your attempt humour about the Oakleys was clearly understood and completely irrelevant. As is your now back tracking and trying to double bluff that you aren't a policeman and that you might this or might that. It's your open statement that you think buying a fake Pinarello is acceptable. Let me remind you,

So the age old saying was true - if it's too good to be true, then it's probably too good to be true. It's not real, it's a fake.

But then I thought about it some more, a new carbon frame for £400 is probably a bargain. I mean, it may even come from the same factory as it's bigger and better cousins, It might even be the same mould or even the same carbon.... I don't know.

So yes it's a fake, but that doesn't bother me.... it still seems like a bargain.

You gonna keep diggin'?

PP

Are you a pilot?

Colinthecop

Pilot Pete wrote:

So Colin from Uig police station.

Uig police station closed in 2005. Are you sure you're a pilot pete...? I thought pilots were meant to be smart. Either you're as dumb as the come or you haven't discovered google.

But yeah, feel free to send a link to my boss, if that's the way you conduct yourself then fill your boots. If it makes you feel better i'm happy to help.

Or if you're happy to wait I could ask him myself. I'll be riding the Loch Ness Etap with him in a couple of months. I'm not sure if he'll arrest me as my replica Pinarello is better than his Felt.

And have you really spent your Friday evening going through my posting history...? Jeez, your life must be a non stop rollercoaster of fun.

:roll:

Oh, and after you've phoned to grass up someone on the internet for seeking opinions on buying a replica, let us know how long they laugh at you before they hang up.

veronese68

Pilot Pete wrote:

Sprool wrote:

^Well said ricky, I'm with you on this.
[q]So for all those haters of replicas/fakes...you need to get off your high horses and consider the real world dynamics and the fact people can't always afford what they want. As long as people are not being lead to think this frame is a real pinarello then there are no issues.[/q]

Only issue is the injuries the rider of this one sustained...




PP

Can't you read? Apparently he's doing Pinarello a favour by marketing their brand, they should pay him really.

veronese68

Colinthecop wrote:

So another question, My mate has done very well for himself. He has a handbuilt Cobra with the worlds best sounding Chevy big block 7.2L lump in it. It's even properly badged. It's not built by AC, it was built in the Midlands. Is that a very nice replica or a fake....? As the law seems to think it's perfectly legal to make a replica, as long as you don't try to pass it off as the real thing. If you build a replica and want to sell it, you have to tell the buyer it's a replica.

I think AC have taken people to court over replicas in the past. Shelby certainly have. Caterham have done over Lotus 7 replicas and Ferrari have done many times in the past. I don't think the law does consider it perfectly legal.

pilot_pete

You can deflect it all you like, but you lack the integrity that is a requirement for your job and have openly admitted it on a public forum. It is not surprising that the public image of your once respected job serving our society is at such a low.

I am genuinely disappointed that you hold a position and such a flawed view of what does and doesn't constitute a crime. And you reckon your colleague holds the same view. :roll:

PP

Colinthecop

Thank you for telling me the requirements of my job...

I feel ashamed that considering the purchase of a replica pushbike has single handedly brought British Policing to its knees.