Another switching from hybrid to road bike

scaryfeet

Hi all,

I've read through loads of topics but figured it'd be easier to post all my questions in one place as I haven't found specific answers. Anyway I'm a newbie, have had a hybrid for a few months and although I love this bike, I want to go faster and longer distances. So I'm thinking road bike. However I have a few concerns I wonder if anyone can help address:

Right now, I don't like cycling on roads. I use bike trails a lot and pavement where I can. Would a road bike handle trails?
Clipless peddles need the right shoes, right? So aside from the cost of the bike, how much will I need to be spending on accessories etc?
I often take a backpack on longer rides, would this defeat the point of getting a road bike and being more aerodynamic? Would a touring bike be better with panniers?
I'm overweight and refuse to wear all the tight gear I see the pros wearing, am I going to look like a complete idiot on a great bike, wearing my normal clothes?
Many thanks!

Jo

ianwilliams

1. It depends on how rough or muddy the trail is. You might want to look at some of the more 'go anywhere' bikes. I think Giant have one. Or cyclocross. Ideally you want to be on the road for your road bike. Try out a cyclability course to build your confidence in traffic, or join a local cycling group (not necessarily a racing club). This was good for me.
2. Yes, but you can get double-sided SPD pedals that have flat pedals for normal shoes on one side. These would be about £20-30 (ebay is cheapest, although if you buy them from a store you can get them fitted FOC). You can then upgrade to the shoes when you want.
3. You would just put stuff in your jersey pockets and saddle bag. No real need for anything more on single day rides.
4. No. You just might think you do...no-one else will care. FWIW you can buy more relaxed fit jerseys (things like Torm etc) and padded mountain bike shorts look more like normal shorts.

Just buy what you enjoy dude. Don't buy something that you don't want to be. It doesn't make sense to worry about aerodynamics and clipless if you're only going to be riding trails.

slowbike

What is stopping you going further or faster on your hybrid? No point getting a road bike if you don't want to ride roads ... you could get a CX, but that's basically a hybrid with drop bars ... TBH, on trails aerodynamics aren't on the top of the list of things to worry about!

markhewitt1978

scaryfeet wrote:

Right now, I don't like cycling on roads. I use bike trails a lot and pavement where I can. Would a road bike handle trails?

You *can* use a road bike on trails, I sometimes do. But they are not best suited, I wouldn't want to be doing more than, say, 10% of my riding off road with a road bike. If that's the case then a road bike isn't for you. However; look at cyclocross, most of the advantages of a road bike but the ability to go off road quickly too.

Clipless peddles need the right shoes, right? So aside from the cost of the bike, how much will I need to be spending on accessories etc?

Well the cost of the pedals, lets say double sided SPD for ease. About £20 for a set of M520's. About £40 for a set of shoes to with them.
I'm overweight and refuse to wear all the tight gear I see the pros wearing, am I going to look like a complete idiot on a great bike, wearing my normal clothes?
[/quote]

There are big advantages to 'proper' cycle clothing, the biggest of which is comfort, it's just so much nicer to wear on the bike than ordinary clothes. The 'pro's use skin tight, most cyclists don't and their jerseys are relatively baggy. The advantage is the big rear pockets meaning you don't need that backpack? What are you going to keep in it anyway? However cycling shorts with padded inserts are a must IMO.

Having said all that; I'm not sure a road bike is for you; if you'd said you do 90% of your riding on the roads and just want to go faster, then yes, but I think you're better off pedalling your hybrid faster

scaryfeet

Thanks for your replies! I should have explained in my first post - I don't like riding on the roads at the moment, but plan to when I'm more comfortable. I've joined a cycling group and they are very supportive. I do like trails though, most of the reason I am loving cycling is to get out of the city, so I think I'll always prefer trails to roads. The hybrid is fine for what I'm doing at the moment, but I just feel like I'm wanting something more "specialised", not something that does several things decently. It was always meant to be a starter kind of bike until I decided if I even liked cycling and what I preferred. I will definitely look at cyclocross, thanks!

scaryfeet

Regarding the clothing and backpack - I literally take everything but the kitchen sink! I bought panniers but don't like the weight on the rear wheel. I really need to cut down on what I take, will try the next day out with the bare minimum .

markhewitt1978

No reason not to buy a road bike, but I would suggest at least riding your hybrid over the winter, mostly to get a better idea of what you want to do, and get a road bike in the spring if you still want to go that way.

markhewitt1978

What do you need on a ride?

Water - bottle sits in bottle cage
Spare inner tube, tyre levers, puncture kit, £10 note - in saddle bag.
Phone, house keys, asthma inhaler, cereal bar (or two), in jersey pocket.

Can't think of anything else you'd need.

daniel_b

scaryfeet wrote:

Hi all,

I've read through loads of topics but figured it'd be easier to post all my questions in one place as I haven't found specific answers. Anyway I'm a newbie, have had a hybrid for a few months and although I love this bike, I want to go faster and longer distances. So I'm thinking road bike. However I have a few concerns I wonder if anyone can help address:

Right now, I don't like cycling on roads. I use bike trails a lot and pavement where I can. Would a road bike handle trails?
Clipless pedals need the right shoes, right? So aside from the cost of the bike, how much will I need to be spending on accessories etc?
I often take a backpack on longer rides, would this defeat the point of getting a road bike and being more aerodynamic? Would a touring bike be better with panniers?
I'm overweight and refuse to wear all the tight gear I see the pros wearing, am I going to look like a complete idiot on a great bike, wearing my normal clothes?
Many thanks!

Jo

Hi Jo, I notice you said 'right now' with regards to not liking riding on roads, dies that mean you have some motivation for changing that in the future?

What do you tend to take that requires a backpack, tools, food, clothing?

If its clothing, then that will likely be a by product of not wearing cycling gear, as the most I take out on a ride would be a small pack up rain jacket that packs down to the size of an apple and can go in a rear jersey pocket, and on occasion arm warmers.
This does not include the spare tubes, tyre levers, multitool and cereal bar I take in my saddlebag. Also the minipump that attaches to the bottlecage.

Shimano m520 pedals would do the job, and can be had for a shade over £15. Shoe prices have already been mentioned, stick to mtb if you want something more easy to walk in.

It has been mentioned already, a cross or CX bike would suit you well.
Come with knobbly tyres, so fine on trails, room for guards and a rack/panniers if you do want to carry lyggage.
And fast enough if you start enjoying the road and want to bung on a pair of 23mm slicks.

simon_masterson

If you want to carry a backpack, carry a backpack. It's not for aerodynamic reasons that I prefer not to wear one. There are also other ways to carry luggage on a bike than employing the rear rack; saddlebags and seatpost packs exist in various sizes. How big is the backpack that you carry?

As for pedals, clips and straps are still a good alternative to clipless if you don't want to buy a new pair of shoes.

slowbike

Simon Masterson wrote:

If you want to carry a backpack, carry a backpack.

I think the question is - why .... what have you got in a backpack that you can't put in other receptacles? I occasionally use one myself - less so now because I've got a rack & bag on top - that's so much more comfortable, but it's only used for commuting/touring - out for a ride is everything in pockets & small saddlebag.
It's quite possible to do >80miles with just pockets for storage.

simon_masterson

Slowbike wrote:

Simon Masterson wrote:

If you want to carry a backpack, carry a backpack.

I think the question is - why .... what have you got in a backpack that you can't put in other receptacles? I occasionally use one myself - less so now because I've got a rack & bag on top - that's so much more comfortable, but it's only used for commuting/touring - out for a ride is everything in pockets & small saddlebag.
It's quite possible to do >80miles with just pockets for storage.

I concur, but I didn't want to make this another 'you carry too much stuff' thread. As I said, I won't carry one if I can avoid it, but objectively it is a viable way of carrying things.

scaryfeet

Thanks again for all your replies. It's quite embarrassing - the amount of irrelevant stuff I take in case of emergencies/for comfort. Me and my brother usually cycle somewhere picturesque, have lunch etc. I usually take things like first aid kit, waterproof clothing (we often cycle to a reservoir and hire kayaks), as well as the usual, innertube, mutli-tool and all that. I always carry both by bike locks just in case we leave the bikes too, I have a massive fear of my bike being stolen.

I don't like cycling with a rucksack, or panniers or any extra weight at all. I've bought a bar bag and saddle bag and am going to go around 25 miles tomorrow and see how I do. This will also be my first long ride alone, another fear!

apreading

scaryfeet wrote:

Anyway I'm a newbie, have had a hybrid for a few months and although I love this bike, I want to go faster and longer distances. So I'm thinking road bike.

Sorry but dont buy a road bike because you expect it to make you go faster and longer - get fitter, train and lose weight for that. You say that you are overweight, so even a significant saving in bike terms on the cycle will not be significant in terms of overall weight including rider and aero gains wont really come into effect at your speeds or size. Not meaning to be rude here but your rationale for making the change doesnt quite work - especially when you then say you want to go off road most of the time.

Off road, more comfort from bigger tyres and good suspension would possibly a bigger help in terms of riding faster and further - if you get a road bike and find the ride harsh off road then you wont go far or fast. No doubt that a road bike will cope but it may not be the nicest ride. If you get a road bike for this then probably the most important thing is to get one with plenty of clearance for 32 or even 35 tyres and maybe even disc brakes.

I may be shot down for saying the above in the roadie forum and it may not be what you came to hear but its the plan truth in my opinion.

littledove44

apreading wrote:

scaryfeet wrote:

Anyway I'm a newbie, have had a hybrid for a few months and although I love this bike, I want to go faster and longer distances. So I'm thinking road bike.

Sorry but dont buy a road bike because you expect it to make you go faster and longer - get fitter, train and lose weight for that. You say that you are overweight, so even a significant saving in bike terms on the cycle will not be significant in terms of overall weight including rider and aero gains wont really come into effect at your speeds or size. Not meaning to be rude here but your rationale for making the change doesnt quite work - especially when you then say you want to go off road most of the time.

Off road, more comfort from bigger tyres and good suspension would possibly a bigger help in terms of riding faster and further - if you get a road bike and find the ride harsh off road then you wont go far or fast. No doubt that a road bike will cope but it may not be the nicest ride. If you get a road bike for this then probably the most important thing is to get one with plenty of clearance for 32 or even 35 tyres and maybe even disc brakes.

I may be shot down for saying the above in the roadie forum and it may not be what you came to hear but its the plan truth in my opinion.

Can I please be the first to shoot?

I agree completely with the sentiment of wanting to go faster and longer. I took up cycling this summer and spent a couple of months on my hybrid. I would ride it regularly for about two hours and on local roads and tracks I would average about 8.5mph. After two hours I would be knackered. A couple of months doing that and average speeds over 10mph as I got fitter and lost weight.

Someone then challenged me to do the bike part of a local triathlon, just over 21 miles. I signed up for that and bought a road bike as well. My average speeds for the exact same courses and duration were immediately over 13mph with the same amount of being knackered at the end.

So, the road bike made me faster, or I could cover a greater distance at the same speed for the same amount of knackering.

I am sure the primary difference was going to skinny tires and the secondary difference was the bike weight reduction.

Go ahead and get the road bike, but keep the hybrid as well if you can. They have different sweet spots and can both be great fun. Variety will make you ride more often, loose more weight and fitness and speed will just happen.

Where you are making a mistake though is thinking that a road bike will be suitable for trails. It won't.

scaryfeet

Just a quick reply as I'm on my way out. To clear up - my goal is to get a road bike once I have got fitter and am happy riding on the roads. My reason being is yes I want to go faster and longer but also drop handle bars appeal to me, I'm talking about probably next spring. That's my goal and I definitely wouldn't get one if I'm not more confident on roads and going longer distances.

simon_masterson

littledove44 wrote:

apreading wrote:

scaryfeet wrote:

Anyway I'm a newbie, have had a hybrid for a few months and although I love this bike, I want to go faster and longer distances. So I'm thinking road bike.

Sorry but dont buy a road bike because you expect it to make you go faster and longer - get fitter, train and lose weight for that. You say that you are overweight, so even a significant saving in bike terms on the cycle will not be significant in terms of overall weight including rider and aero gains wont really come into effect at your speeds or size. Not meaning to be rude here but your rationale for making the change doesnt quite work - especially when you then say you want to go off road most of the time.

Off road, more comfort from bigger tyres and good suspension would possibly a bigger help in terms of riding faster and further - if you get a road bike and find the ride harsh off road then you wont go far or fast. No doubt that a road bike will cope but it may not be the nicest ride. If you get a road bike for this then probably the most important thing is to get one with plenty of clearance for 32 or even 35 tyres and maybe even disc brakes.

I may be shot down for saying the above in the roadie forum and it may not be what you came to hear but its the plan truth in my opinion.

Can I please be the first to shoot?

I agree completely with the sentiment of wanting to go faster and longer. I took up cycling this summer and spent a couple of months on my hybrid. I would ride it regularly for about two hours and on local roads and tracks I would average about 8.5mph. After two hours I would be knackered. A couple of months doing that and average speeds over 10mph as I got fitter and lost weight.

Someone then challenged me to do the bike part of a local triathlon, just over 21 miles. I signed up for that and bought a road bike as well. My average speeds for the exact same courses and duration were immediately over 13mph with the same amount of being knackered at the end.

So, the road bike made me faster, or I could cover a greater distance at the same speed for the same amount of knackering.

I am sure the primary difference was going to skinny tires and the secondary difference was the bike weight reduction.

Go ahead and get the road bike, but keep the hybrid as well if you can. They have different sweet spots and can both be great fun. Variety will make you ride more often, loose more weight and fitness and speed will just happen.

Where you are making a mistake though is thinking that a road bike will be suitable for trails. It won't.

With the greatest of respect, unless the area you live in is seriously hilly, the equipment is of little relevance in your case. Skinny tyres and reduced weight don't work miracles. I'm not very surprised that you went faster on the road bike, but road bikes are generally more gratifying to ride [on roads] and offer favourable positioning [both for rider comfort and aerodynamics] and gearing. To look at extreme cases, look at Graeme Obree's Beastie bike or Andy Wilkinson's custom Dolan, or even the path racers of yesteryear; the latter bikes were very heavy including very heavy wheels and tyres, had very limited gearing, and didn't offer the same aerodynamic positioning or rider comfort that a modem bike can.

Clearly there is a difference, and clearly a road bike is worth having, but there are plenty of powerful riders that can set impressive times on hybrid bikes. No bike can increase the capabilities of its rider.

littledove44

"Clearly there is a difference, and clearly a road bike is worth having, but there are plenty of powerful riders that can set impressive times on hybrid bikes. No bike can increase the capabilities of its rider."

That's true, but we are not talking about plenty of riders. We are talking about one bloke with a defined energy capacity at this point in time.

With a road bike with less rolling resistance he will go further with the same effort, or do the same ride at a higher speed. You can't argue with physics.

akc42

I was a newbie (or rather hadn't ridden a bike since school days - am now 62) and rode a hybrid all summer. I have armadillo tyres, which are heavily treaded but not knobbly. I have lost a lot of weight, but found I was only going off road very occassionally, so recently bought a lightweight road bike.

1) I go a lot faster on the road bike - tyres is one factor particularly the higher pressure, but I am feeling the difference from the stiffness of the frame and from the aerodynamics.

2) I was scared about the gearing on hills (hybrid has a triple with granny gears - road bike is just a compact) - but this morning I climbed my hardest hill (over 16% at one point) on the road bike and did a personal best.

3) I get less bottom ache on long rides on the road bike - that is despite the saddle initially feeling harder - at over 40 miles I know longer have the dull ache I had with the hybrid.

4) Going off road on the road bike is not a pleasant experience. The harshness of the ride is the main thing that makes it horrible. For this reason alone I am glad I decided n+1 is the way to go for me.

simon_masterson

littledove44 wrote:

With a road bike with less rolling resistance he will go further with the same effort, or do the same ride at a higher speed. You can't argue with physics.

The vast majority of your effort is spent pushing air out of the way; particularly if we are talking as we are about low speeds and short distances (and not sub-23 minute 10 mile TTs or 12 hour TTs), the effect of rolling resistance is not very important; same with weight. It is the improved aerodynamic positioning that makes the difference. All other things being equal, it's just a matter of physics, but of course in the case of all but those of the highest level of physical conditioning, they generally aren't.

scaryfeet

Thanks again for replies. I'm female by the way, although you can call me bloke if you wish!

That's interesting about having more comfort on long distance on a road bike. My hybrid is really more toward the mountain bike end, the tyres are really wide with a good tread on them. Would I road bike handle proper bike paths? As I've found a few beautiful routes lately and have seen other road bikes on them.

I don't want a road bike to make cycling easier, I expect only fitness to do that. And it's coming a lot quicker than I thought! Now if I could only stop eating too much I'd be sorted!

markhewitt1978

littledove44 wrote:

Someone then challenged me to do the bike part of a local triathlon, just over 21 miles. I signed up for that and bought a road bike as well. My average speeds for the exact same courses and duration were immediately over 13mph with the same amount of being knackered at the end.

So, the road bike made me faster, or I could cover a greater distance at the same speed for the same amount of knackering.

Yep, sounds similar to my experience. A thing you'll learn is that there are significant number of people who are "Don't buy a new bike HTFU instead"; when of course a better bike *will* allow you to go faster, but more importantly will be more fun to ride. The only thing is it probably won't be as fast as your first expect

markhewitt1978

scaryfeet wrote:

Would I road bike handle proper bike paths? As I've found a few beautiful routes lately and have seen other road bikes on them.

Depends, I've no idea what you mean by 'proper bike path'.

scaryfeet

I mean the NCN paths. Some are a bit loose but I see road bikes on them.

markhewitt1978

What is an "NTC Path"?

scaryfeet

It was a typo, I meant NCN.

markhewitt1978

Fair. I do ride my road bike on those sorts of paths from time to time some are tarmac which is fine. Some are nicely compacted gravel which is ok, but this can vary to quite rocky within the same path which can be a problem. I will tend to avoid them in the winter too but that's just because I don't like cleaning my bike

scaryfeet

Thanks. Good to know I can probably still use those then to avoid major roads. Still considering cyclocross too, I have several months to think about it anyway. I rode 30 miles yesterday with no bag, nothing but a few tools and a bottle of water and it was a much nicer ride. However I found myself running out of energy after around 20 and in the middle of nowhere so couldn't buy any food. Are energy gels a worthwhile investment for those occasions?

markhewitt1978

scaryfeet wrote:

Thanks. Good to know I can probably still use those then to avoid major roads. Still considering cyclocross too,

I'd say you want a road bike if gravel forms 10% or less of your normal riding, as road bikes are best suited for roads! If you're talking more like 50/50 road and trail then consider the cyclocross bike.

I rode 30 miles yesterday with no bag, nothing but a few tools and a bottle of water and it was a much nicer ride. However I found myself running out of energy after around 20 and in the middle of nowhere so couldn't buy any food. Are energy gels a worthwhile investment for those occasions?

Sounds about right . You can take gels if you want but I find them sticky and a pain to open etc. Personally I'd stick with a small pack of jelly babies or a cereal bar, eat that half way through your ride and it'll help you through the second half. As you get fitter you'll have less need to eat as you won't use up your stored energy quite as quickly.

simon_masterson

markhewitt1978 wrote:

littledove44 wrote:

Someone then challenged me to do the bike part of a local triathlon, just over 21 miles. I signed up for that and bought a road bike as well. My average speeds for the exact same courses and duration were immediately over 13mph with the same amount of being knackered at the end.

So, the road bike made me faster, or I could cover a greater distance at the same speed for the same amount of knackering.

Yep, sounds similar to my experience. A thing you'll learn is that there are significant number of people who are "Don't buy a new bike HTFU instead"; when of course a better bike *will* allow you to go faster, but more importantly will be more fun to ride. The only thing is it probably won't be as fast as your first expect

And plenty of others - many of them also ignorant - feed misplaced anxiety about the adequacy of equipment. The performance differences are small, the performance fluctuations are not, and the suggestions for improvements and upgrades are very often misguided. If having a shiny bike makes a huge difference to your time, then you probably lack the psychological resolve needed to go flat out in a time trial position anyway.

awavey

Simon Masterson wrote:

markhewitt1978 wrote:

littledove44 wrote:

Someone then challenged me to do the bike part of a local triathlon, just over 21 miles. I signed up for that and bought a road bike as well. My average speeds for the exact same courses and duration were immediately over 13mph with the same amount of being knackered at the end.

So, the road bike made me faster, or I could cover a greater distance at the same speed for the same amount of knackering.

Yep, sounds similar to my experience. A thing you'll learn is that there are significant number of people who are "Don't buy a new bike HTFU instead"; when of course a better bike *will* allow you to go faster, but more importantly will be more fun to ride. The only thing is it probably won't be as fast as your first expect

And plenty of others - many of them also ignorant - feed misplaced anxiety about the adequacy of equipment. The performance differences are small, the performance fluctuations are not, and the suggestions for improvements and upgrades are very often misguided. If having a shiny bike makes a huge difference to your time, then you probably lack the psychological resolve needed to go flat out in a time trial position anyway.

I wouldnt discount the psychology of a shinier bike out of hand, cycling is every bit a head game as well as down to the pure physics of it,but the anxiety is the confusion as to why two apparently opposing views hold such almost equal weight in the cycling community, the MSM holding two seperate views on cycling I can understand, but youd have thought most cyclists would be able to analyse their own performance over time more accurately