Hubs for custom wheelset

Kubotai
Kubotai Posts: 20
edited August 2013 in Road buying advice
Thinking about having a custom set built based around H+Son Archetype rims and looking for a great set of hubs. What would be the best option? Looking for a high quality set that builds a stiff wheel, rolls smoothly, is lightweight and durable and preferably engages quickly (but not essential). Price is of course not a priority.

Some thoughts I had include Alchemy ELF/ORC-UL, White Industries T11, DT Swiss 240s, Chris King R45, Goldtec Road and Acros .54 road, which all seem to have their own particular strengths but it makes me feel like I'm drowning in options.
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Comments

  • bondurant
    bondurant Posts: 858
    Any thoughts on cartridge bearings vs cup and cone? Number of spokes?
  • Grill
    Grill Posts: 5,610
    Alchemy. Do it.
    English Cycles V3 | Cervelo P5 | Cervelo T4 | Trek Domane Koppenberg
  • Kubotai
    Kubotai Posts: 20
    Not sure about the bearings, although I don't much care for Shimano hubs simply because I find them boring for some reason (not that the 240s are that much more exciting).
    Spokes will be 24 front, 28 rear, CX Ray.
  • ugo.santalucia
    ugo.santalucia Posts: 28,301
    I would look elsewhere... the hubs you mention are very light, but I have seen broken flanges in DT Swiss 240 and in CK 45 hubs. Not in the others, but probably because I have never come across any of those. Light hubs are crap for the money they cost.
    As above, Royce makes the best hubs money can buy, otherwise Dura Ace and Campagnolo Record are very good and the italian made PMP are also very good hubs.
    The fast engagement issue is bolxxcks, read this article I wrote some time ago

    http://paolocoppo.drupalgardens.com/con ... engagement
    left the forum March 2023
  • Grill
    Grill Posts: 5,610
    Fairwheel thinks the Alchemy are the nuts and Fairwheel is never wrong :P
    http://fairwheelbikes.com/c/forums/topic/2012-hub-review-information-overload/
    English Cycles V3 | Cervelo P5 | Cervelo T4 | Trek Domane Koppenberg
  • ugo.santalucia
    ugo.santalucia Posts: 28,301
    Grill wrote:
    Fairwheel thinks the Alchemy are the nuts and Fairwheel is never wrong :P
    http://fairwheelbikes.com/c/forums/topic/2012-hub-review-information-overload/

    Do they have a distribution in place? I mean, when the freehub breaks do you need to write a letter to America and wait 3 weeks for something (possibly very expensive) to arrive in the mail or you can get something a bit quicker available round here?
    left the forum March 2023
  • Grill
    Grill Posts: 5,610
    Grill wrote:
    Fairwheel thinks the Alchemy are the nuts and Fairwheel is never wrong :P
    http://fairwheelbikes.com/c/forums/topic/2012-hub-review-information-overload/

    Do they have a distribution in place? I mean, when the freehub breaks do you need to write a letter to America and wait 3 weeks for something (possibly very expensive) to arrive in the mail or you can get something a bit quicker available round here?

    Well I'm in Arizona 3-4 times a year so I'm more than happy to bring back spares. :mrgreen:
    English Cycles V3 | Cervelo P5 | Cervelo T4 | Trek Domane Koppenberg
  • Kubotai
    Kubotai Posts: 20
    Lots of information there. Thanks Grill. Have you ridden the Alchemy hubs yourself?

    I'm not too worried about the durability of the light hubs. I'm not a heavy rider in either bodyweight or riding style and the wheels will be built by a highly regarded builder. If I make sure I maintain the wheels normally I can't imagine flanges breaking. But I will check out the Royce hubs.

    The fast engagement article is nice. I don't see it as much of a performance improvement, I just like the idea of making the wheels as responsive as possible. I guess that's my inner gearhead speaking.
  • Grill
    Grill Posts: 5,610
    Not personally, but I have buddies that swear by them. If you're looking for light then Tune Mig/Mags are the bomb.
    English Cycles V3 | Cervelo P5 | Cervelo T4 | Trek Domane Koppenberg
  • estampida
    estampida Posts: 1,008
    hope pro3
  • Barteos
    Barteos Posts: 657
    edited August 2013
    hope-pro3-hubs-zoom.jpg

    Fit and forget for years.

    "CNC machined in Barnoldswick, England
    Bearing type: Cartridge (1728, 61803)
    Hub Body: 2014 T6 aluminium
    Colours: Silver, Black, Red, Blue, Gold & Gunsmoke
    Hole Drilling: 16, 20, 24 (suitable for radial building)
    28, 32, 36 (cannot be radially built)
    Rear width: 130 and 135mm
    Cassette body: Aluminium (steel option available)
    Ratchet type: 4 pawl (24t engagement)
    Weight: Front 115g, Rear 263g

    Is it just me or Hope is somehow shunned by roadies for some irrational reasons...?

    P.S. All quality hubs "roll smoothly" enough :wink:
  • ugo.santalucia
    ugo.santalucia Posts: 28,301
    Kubotai wrote:
    I'm not too worried about the durability of the light hubs. I'm not a heavy rider in either bodyweight or riding style and the wheels will be built by a highly regarded builder.

    Flange failures have not got much to do with your body weight. It is a rather typical fatigue crack that develops perpendicular to the spoke. Interestingly, it doesn't seem to depend on spoke tension either, as I have seen them happenning on a NON Drive side, where the tension is pretty low.
    The killer is mileage, if you want to get 50,000 miles out of your hubs, get some proper engineering, if you are happy with 10,000, then get the light ones
    left the forum March 2023
  • drlodge
    drlodge Posts: 4,826
    If cost is not an issue, get the Royce hubs, end of.

    I considered Royce but in the end went for the Campagnolo Record hubs to match in with the rest of the group set, but they're available in 32H only. Some wheelbuilders (like the one I used) don't like CK hubs despite their following for headsets.

    Something to consider with hubs is that, while rims and spokes might get replaced, the hubs should last the lifetime of the bike. Therefore I personally did not want to risk buying expensive hubs that may not last the duration - and light weight hubs have to make a comprise to save weight. I'll say it again - get the Royce hubs.
    WyndyMilla Massive Attack | Rourke 953 | Condor Italia 531 Pro | Boardman CX Pro | DT Swiss RR440 Tubeless Wheels
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  • Kubotai
    Kubotai Posts: 20
    Thanks all.

    Hope is an option. I also ride mountain bikes and know their products well.

    I think 10,000 miles is fine. I don't do long group rides. My road bike is for shorter solo rides. I also run, ride mountain bikes, spend days in the gym, before I get to 10,000 miles I will probably be looking for a new bike.

    Had a quick look at Royce, but blimey, that rear hub is as heavy as some sets. I can imagine that would roll for 50,000 miles.

    Tune Mig/Mag is the other end of the scale. Seems to be getting into the realm of compromises to lower weight and that is something I don't like.

    Anyone familiar with the Goldtec hubs? They're supposed to be developed with feedback from the British Olympic cycling team and look very nice.
  • ugo.santalucia
    ugo.santalucia Posts: 28,301
    If you are happy with 10,000 miles on a premium set of wheels, I am afraid I have no advice for you... :shock:
    left the forum March 2023
  • Kubotai
    Kubotai Posts: 20
    I don't mean that literally and do understand what you mean and certainly appreciate your advice. I simply do not have the need for a wheelset that is aimed at endurance riding and extreme mileages. My rides are short solo rides like in a triathlon or time trial. Because I might be moving to the coast within the next few years I decided against deeper aero wheels due to the wind there and am looking for wheels to suit my type of riding. Hubs like the ones I mentioned seem to me to be perfectly suitable for my wishes in terms of performance as well as durability.
  • Barteos wrote:




    Is it just me or Hope is somehow shunned by roadies for some irrational reasons...?

    P.S. All quality hubs "roll smoothly" enough :wink:


    Totally irrational maybe .... but the 'racket from the rachet' on a hope hub when I sit behind one on a group ride makes me discount ever considering Hope as a hub option on a road bike.
  • Rob Noall wrote:
    Barteos wrote:




    Is it just me or Hope is somehow shunned by roadies for some irrational reasons...?

    P.S. All quality hubs "roll smoothly" enough :wink:


    Totally irrational maybe .... but the 'racket from the rachet' on a hope hub when I sit behind one on a group ride makes me discount ever considering Hope as a hub option on a road bike.

    Ah, well you see this is exactly the reason I've just bought some. People have to know how easy you are finding it. They are the definition of marmite I suppose.
  • Kubotai
    Kubotai Posts: 20
    Rob Noall wrote:

    Totally irrational maybe .... but the 'racket from the rachet' on a hope hub when I sit behind one on a group ride makes me discount ever considering Hope as a hub option on a road bike.

    Ah, well you see this is exactly the reason I've just bought some. People have to know how easy you are finding it.
    That made me chuckle! :lol:
  • Barteos
    Barteos Posts: 657
    Rob Noall wrote:
    Barteos wrote:




    Is it just me or Hope is somehow shunned by roadies for some irrational reasons...?

    P.S. All quality hubs "roll smoothly" enough :wink:


    Totally irrational maybe .... but the 'racket from the rachet' on a hope hub when I sit behind one on a group ride makes me discount ever considering Hope as a hub option on a road bike.

    Good point but CK hubs are not much different. Perhaps it's got something to do with the "dirty" MTB brand image?
    Besides, isn't 99% of riding time usually spent pedalling? :wink:
  • springtide9
    springtide9 Posts: 1,731
    Rob Noall wrote:
    Barteos wrote:
    Is it just me or Hope is somehow shunned by roadies for some irrational reasons...?
    P.S. All quality hubs "roll smoothly" enough :wink:
    Totally irrational maybe .... but the 'racket from the rachet' on a hope hub when I sit behind one on a group ride makes me discount ever considering Hope as a hub option on a road bike.

    Ah, well you see this is exactly the reason I've just bought some. People have to know how easy you are finding it. They are the definition of marmite I suppose.

    +1 for the post of the week (or year!)
    Simon
  • troj
    troj Posts: 43
    Does Hope do low spoke counts??? I'm looking for a hub in 20/24 spoke count with a bit of durability. I ride Hope Hubson the winter bike. I use the loud free wheel noise to warn people that I'm approaching. When I'm bunch riding you don't hear the free wheel that much as I'm either on the front or hanging on :wink: !!
  • ugo.santalucia
    ugo.santalucia Posts: 28,301
    troj wrote:
    Does Hope do low spoke counts??? I'm looking for a hub in 20/24 spoke count with a bit of durability. I ride Hope Hubson the winter bike. I use the loud free wheel noise to warn people that I'm approaching. When I'm bunch riding you don't hear the free wheel that much as I'm either on the front or hanging on :wink: !!

    Yes they do, but you won't find them from the main online retailers. Order them in a shop and ask specifically for the newer freehub if you are on Campagnolo, as the older one won't take 11 speed. They also have an 11 speed Shimano freehub, but only works for cassettes with at least a 28 sprocket
    left the forum March 2023
  • goonz
    goonz Posts: 3,106
    Can someone tell me wht are the big differences between the really expensive hubs and the lower level hubs?

    Is it just weight and durability?
    Scott Speedster S20 Roadie for Speed
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  • ugo.santalucia
    ugo.santalucia Posts: 28,301
    goonz wrote:
    Can someone tell me wht are the big differences between the really expensive hubs and the lower level hubs?

    Is it just weight and durability?

    Mainly weight... sometimes there is better engineering, other times there isn't and they are only pricey because they are made in the western world as opposed to Taiwan.
    When I look at Tune hubs I wonder where are the 400 pounds or so... :shock:
    left the forum March 2023
  • Camcycle1974
    Camcycle1974 Posts: 1,356
    When I was speccing wheels I was encouraged by the builder to buy Via Components road hubs. 269Rear and 80front. Not massively light but not too dear either. I was convinced by the quality, which is superior to Hope but similar in terms of cost. They have a loud freewheel too which does indeed make people in front of you speed up!
  • ugo.santalucia
    ugo.santalucia Posts: 28,301
    When I was speccing wheels I was encouraged by the builder to buy Via Components road hubs. 269Rear and 80front. Not massively light but not too dear either. I was convinced by the quality, which is superior to Hope but similar in terms of cost. They have a loud freewheel too which does indeed make people in front of you speed up!

    They are not superior to Hope, they are lighter. Those are made by Bitex, I have seen them at BLB.
    left the forum March 2023
  • styxd
    styxd Posts: 3,234
    Hope or PMP wpould be where my money would go. Although Goldtec used to make decent mtb hubs, wonder if the road ones are any good? Perhaps give them a go and report back
  • Camcycle1974
    Camcycle1974 Posts: 1,356
    When I was speccing wheels I was encouraged by the builder to buy Via Components road hubs. 269Rear and 80front. Not massively light but not too dear either. I was convinced by the quality, which is superior to Hope but similar in terms of cost. They have a loud freewheel too which does indeed make people in front of you speed up!

    They are not superior to Hope, they are lighter. Those are made by Bitex, I have seen them at BLB.

    Ugo , as always i bow to your superior knowledge. Are they crap then? :D