I hate my brakes! Options please...

supermurph09

The performance of my brakes gives me zero confidence. When I needed them most a few weeks ago they let me down badly and I've lost all faith in them to the point it's affecting my riding, in particular descending. I can't deny that a tiny bit of this might be in my head due to a slight off but rather than shell out for a wheel upgrade that I don't need, I've decided to get my bike back to how I feel it should be.

I've had it checked out, even had a cable replaced, added swissstop green pads but still the feel of the rear brake and lever is spongey and just the whole feel to me is not good. I've seen some Ultegra brakes on Wiggle that I discussed on another thread but wanted to know what other options I have for new brakes, im talking calipers the lot. New improved brakes will serve a number of purposes, improve on looks, but more importantly, (even if its 30% placebo effect) give me my confidence back.

Opinions / Options please. Budget is £150.

Grill

What calipers do you currently have?

duckson

What brake calipers do you have now?

supermurph09

Sorry, Shimano BR-R561,
http://www.cube.eu/road/road-race/agree-gtc-race/

mfin

And how heavy are you?

supermurph09

mfin wrote:

And how heavy are you?

78KG, GSOH, own teeth. Can cook.

Grill

Supermurph09 wrote:

Sorry, Shimano BR-R561,
http://www.cube.eu/road/road-race/agree-gtc-race/

Is that a long drop caliper? If so you'll need to go for the R650 instead of the standard Ultegra.

mfin

Supermurph09 wrote:

mfin wrote:

And how heavy are you?

78KG, GSOH, own teeth. Can cook.

was worth asking ...you're not wrong in expecting/wanting great braking performance then.

Have the brakes always been bad? ...or has something got worse?

supermurph09

Grill wrote:

Supermurph09 wrote:

Sorry, Shimano BR-R561,
http://www.cube.eu/road/road-race/agree-gtc-race/

Is that a long drop caliper? If so you'll need to go for the R650 instead of the standard Ultegra.

Done some checking and they are long reach, not sure how I can search for replacements and know if the ones I'm looking at will bloody fit! Minefield.

supermurph09

mfin wrote:

Supermurph09 wrote:

mfin wrote:

And how heavy are you?

78KG, GSOH, own teeth. Can cook.

was worth asking ...you're not wrong in expecting/wanting great braking performance then.

Have the brakes always been bad? ...or has something got worse?

From memory I never had a problem with them to start with, then for a couple of rides they didn't feel quite so sharp, then as mentioned I needed some performance and it just wasn't there, admittedly it was a steep twisty drop but there was no stopping power and then skidding, nothing in between. After that they've just felt rubbish. I know a small % is in my head, would be worth letting someone else test them properly I guess, but it's not just that. I hate the feel of them and that can't be good.

supermurph09

Higher spec cube http://www.cube.eu/road/road-race/liten ... r-hpc-pro/ has these on http://www.halfords.com/webapp/wcs/stor ... 73957#tab1

I wonder if they coud be a good option. 10% off with BC membership as well.

cougie

Have you cleaned the rims lately ?

pkripper

Get some yokozuna cables and swissstop pads - if they still feel poo after that (they won't) then get some sram force calipers for the best price / performance unless you can find better secondhand

supermurph09

cougie wrote:

Have you cleaned the rims lately ?

Are you thinking I've put cleaning product on them that's made them less resistant? There could be some mileage in that, if so any suggestions for getting it all off without harming the wheels? (Easton EA50).

supermurph09

pkripper wrote:

Get some yokozuna cables and swissstop pads - if they still feel poo after that (they won't) then get some sram force calipers for the best price / performance unless you can find better secondhand

Swissstop greens, made no difference.

Bordersroadie

Supermurph09 wrote:

Sorry, Shimano BR-R561,
http://www.cube.eu/road/road-race/agree-gtc-race/

Murph, I upgraded my Cube from these to Ultegra and was astounded by the improvement, far greater than expected to be honest. Way more powerful, far less lever pressure needed, much more confidence decending now. I had greens in the old brakes but the standard Ultegra are superb (OpenPro rims) so I have no need to transfer the Swissstops. A worthwhile upgrade, going to Ultegra brakes, definitely.

The only drawback is that I now want to upgrade my wet bike from Tektro to Shimano R650 which are Ultegra level. The Tektros even with Swissstop greens are way inferior to the standard Ultegra on my dry bike.

patrickf

Supermurph09 wrote:

pkripper wrote:

Get some yokozuna cables and swissstop pads - if they still feel poo after that (they won't) then get some sram force calipers for the best price / performance unless you can find better secondhand

Swissstop greens, made no difference.

I've tried SwissStop Greens after KoolStop Salmons. Personally I've gone back to KoolStops. They now do a new version that doesn't have the cleaning flange on the back and has more on the pad.

As for the rims, if there's anything on them (or the pads) then that could affect performance. Some normal citrus degreaser should sort that out.

On a side note I went from some unbranded Trek calipers to Shimano BR-650s and feel much happier with them. They're long reach so should be suitable for your bike.

bondurant

+1 for R650s if you need long reach brakes.

bondurant

Ignore me. You need short reach brakes. I'd go for Ultegra.

patrickf

Good shout. I thought all non series calipers are long reach but it seems only the 400 and 600 series calipers are long reach?

According to the spec you've got 6700 series shifters. If you're sure you need short reach brakes then I'd get a set of Ultegra calipers.

passout

As above - check out Merlin Cycles.

mfin

Supermurph09 wrote:

cougie wrote:

Have you cleaned the rims lately ?

Are you thinking I've put cleaning product on them that's made them less resistant? There could be some mileage in that, if so any suggestions for getting it all off without harming the wheels? (Easton EA50).

If you've got anything on them while cleaning like GT85 or anything like that, then you need to clean the rims as that will/could very likely be the reason!

What kind of products do you think you might have got on the rims then?

supermurph09

Bordersroadie wrote:

Supermurph09 wrote:

Sorry, Shimano BR-R561,
http://www.cube.eu/road/road-race/agree-gtc-race/

Murph, I upgraded my Cube from these to Ultegra and was astounded by the improvement, far greater than expected to be honest. Way more powerful, far less lever pressure needed, much more confidence decending now. I had greens in the old brakes but the standard Ultegra are superb (OpenPro rims) so I have no need to transfer the Swissstops. A worthwhile upgrade, going to Ultegra brakes, definitely.

The only drawback is that I now want to upgrade my wet bike from Tektro to Shimano R650 which are Ultegra level. The Tektros even with Swissstop greens are way inferior to the standard Ultegra on my dry bike.

Thanks for the input, I think for the price (less than £100) its worth the punt

mfin wrote:

Supermurph09 wrote:

cougie wrote:

Have you cleaned the rims lately ?

Are you thinking I've put cleaning product on them that's made them less resistant? There could be some mileage in that, if so any suggestions for getting it all off without harming the wheels? (Easton EA50).

If you've got anything on them while cleaning like GT85 or anything like that, then you need to clean the rims as that will/could very likely be the reason!

What kind of products do you think you might have got on the rims then?

I use the Muck Off products, I think before the brakes arrive I'll give them a proper clean but its not just the stopping power its the feel so a few different issues. Thanks though, appreciate it.

supermurph09

Can someone tell me if these are the model I need: http://www.jejamescycles.co.uk/shimano- ... d6170.html

This is my LBS, I'll call them but if you can let me know that would be great.

supermurph09

Spoke with JE James and he says these will fit fine: http://www.jejamescycles.co.uk/shimano- ... 78671.html

patrickf

Supermurph09 wrote:

Spoke with JE James and he says these will fit fine: http://www.jejamescycles.co.uk/shimano- ... 78671.html

Good price too. While you're at it just make sure that all the bolts are tight on the calipers and that they don't wiggle about.

One of my R650 calipers went a little bit loose recently and it just needed nipping up a little.

wishitwasallflat

Supermurph09 wrote:

cougie wrote:

Have you cleaned the rims lately ?

Are you thinking I've put cleaning product on them that's made them less resistant? There could be some mileage in that, if so any suggestions for getting it all off without harming the wheels? (Easton EA50).

Scrub the rim with normal soapy water - I use Car Shampoo with a little Swarfega Degreaser mixed in - and once dry wipe the braking surface with a rag dipped in Acetone (Nail varnish remover). Don't forget to also remover your pads - pick out any metal - and dress the surface by rubbing them gently on sandpaper.

cycleclinic

All this talk of long drop calipers and R650 is the more expensive way of doing it. Miche Performance calipers are £20 in most places, the pads are a bit crap so change them. I am currently sing Aztec Road plus pads on my bike and the stopping is great. I am also using campag brake casing and metal ferrules I do not know if that make any difference. I am sure the R650 will hel a bit but in my experience most stopping issue are down to the pads. I am not a fan of Swiss stop greens they are very hard on rims.

cycleclinic

Damm I missed a couple of posts. Look like my post is redundant now.

supermurph09

Ordered the Ultegra 6700. £69.99, worth a punt at that price IMO.

supermurph09

Brakes fitted today, 20 miles completed with some steep descents and I have to say the improvement is very noticeable. My confidence has been restored, I'd say for £69 that's money we'll spent.