Advice for buying a German bike

Vladislav

Ive been looking around for quite some time, and i kind of like german bikes like radon, cube, ive got a few shops near me, and they doing quite a good discounts on a models of 2012, 30% off. But there is such a big choice of them so im a little confused again
Please tell me which ones will have a better fork, gears, brakes / price ratio All those different names confusing
here is a few links:
1. Radon Race 7.0 2013 (1000£)
http://www.bike-discount.de/shop/a78450 ... e-7-0.html

2. Cube Reaction GTC SL 2012 (1250£ after 30% off)
http://www.paulscycles.co.uk/products.p ... b67s2p4217

3.Cube Reaction SLT 2012 (1100£ after 30%off)
http://www.paulscycles.co.uk/products.p ... b67s2p4214

4. Cube Reaction GTC Race 2012 (1050£ after 34% off)
http://www.paulscycles.co.uk/products.p ... b67s2p4216

5. Cube Reaction GTC Pro 2012 (1000£ after 30% off)
http://www.paulscycles.co.uk/products.p ... b67s2p4215

6. Cube Reaction Race 2012 (1000£ after 31% off)
http://www.paulscycles.co.uk/products.p ... b67s2p4212

7. Cube Reaction SL 2012 (1000£ after 35% off)
http://www.paulscycles.co.uk/products.p ... b67s2p4213

8. Cube LTD SL 2012 (cheapest one at 750£ after 33% off)
http://www.paulscycles.co.uk/products.p ... b67s2p4210

my head is spinning after all those bikes :shock: any advice will be appreciated. Thank you very much!

warpcow

Personally, I'd buy no.4 on your list since I prefer Rockshox forks and don't mind SRAM gears. Also, the brakes are good and the wheels are ok. It seems the best mix of value and good quality for me in that price range. They're all good though, so it's really up to you whether you want to spend £750 or £1000 (the one for £750 is still a very good bike, just that you don't quite get as much for your money).

Long_Time_Lurker

I have the Race SL and would say that it is a good bike for the price. Bear in mind that the Cubes there are xc bikes - great for woodland trails and long rides, not as good on the downhill stuff.
It has been argued that they feel a bit 'boring', which is true to a point.
I use mine for the coast-to-coast and 25+ mile rides on a weekend, but would consider something else if I was doing quick blasts around trail centres.

Vladislav

Thanks! I dont think i will do blasts around trail centres a lot mostly will be like you said woodland, roads, etc.
Cubes feel a bit boring? never heard of that. why? i want really to enjoy the ride, so no boring stuff for me!
And why would be cube not as good on a downhill stuff? Not as good as what? as full sus you mean?
My friend just got Cube full sus, but i dont think i will need that, thats too extreme
i suppose its more or less the same frame and specs as hardtails of different major MTB brands? tbh i would love to do a bit of downhill stuff when i will get more confidence with the bike.
Im leaning towards number 5, Reaction GTC Pro. will it do the job nicely?

Vladislav

warpcow wrote:

Personally, I'd buy no.4 on your list since I prefer Rockshox forks and don't mind SRAM gears. Also, the brakes are good and the wheels are ok. It seems the best mix of value and good quality for me in that price range. They're all good though, so it's really up to you whether you want to spend £750 or £1000 (the one for £750 is still a very good bike, just that you don't quite get as much for your money).

Most people i know saying that shimano is much better than SRAM . i dont know is there any real difference?

Long_Time_Lurker

It's all about the geometery of the frame. Ive heard them referred to as 'boring' because it is more stretched out than bigger travel hardtails - very comfortable, but doesnt feel as 'chuckable' as 'All Mountain bikes' like an Orange Crush, Ragley Piglet or Saracen Zen for example. (I use them as examples as that is what my mates ride, so what i have ridden on.) With those you feel more on-top of the bike, very easy to bunny-hop etc. They also feel safer going down steep trails as you seem to be able to shift your weight better over the bike. You don't get that range of movement when you are more stretched out over the frame. (At least that is my and my mates opinions).

It's not a description I would use - i would call it neutral. It's not a bad thing if your rides necessitate it - if I'm doing a 30 mile ride up and down a walking trail in Northumberland my mates are struggling, whereas I'm flying.
I'm riding a 20" frame, but could have dropped to an 18" to get a more chuckable feel. I think it would have worked, it just wasn't for me. Give it a go - the geometry on all of the Cube hardtails feel very similar, so if you are good on one, you will be good on the rest.

chez_m356

Long Time Lurker wrote:

Sorry - probably a bit harsh, but Ive heard them referred to as 'boring' because it is stretched out - very comfortable, but doesnt feel as chuckable as an all-mountain equivalents like an Orange Crush, Ragley Piglet or Saracen Zen for example.

the cubes in the links are xc orientated bikes, not hardcore trail machines like the ones you mentioned above, not really comparable

Long_Time_Lurker

chez_m356 wrote:

Long Time Lurker wrote:

Sorry - probably a bit harsh, but Ive heard them referred to as 'boring' because it is stretched out - very comfortable, but doesnt feel as chuckable as an all-mountain equivalents like an Orange Crush, Ragley Piglet or Saracen Zen for example.

the cubes in the links are xc orientated bikes, not hardcore trail machines like the ones you mentioned above, not really comparable

That's my point - i was justifying the 'boring' tag. The reviews have referred to them as 'boring', but have been comparing them to AM machines.

warpcow

Vladislav wrote:

warpcow wrote:

Personally, I'd buy no.4 on your list since I prefer Rockshox forks and don't mind SRAM gears. Also, the brakes are good and the wheels are ok. It seems the best mix of value and good quality for me in that price range. They're all good though, so it's really up to you whether you want to spend £750 or £1000 (the one for £750 is still a very good bike, just that you don't quite get as much for your money).

Most people i know saying that shimano is much better than SRAM . i dont know is there any real difference?

It's pretty much personal taste, but it's one of those things that gets people all riled up for some reason. I prefer SRAM, but my current bike has Shimano and the performance is pretty much the same. It's mainly just the ergonomics of the shifter I like better.

I'd still take the Race as the tyres alone are worth the £50 extra over the Pro. The ones are the Pro are hard compound rubbish.

Vladislav

Long Time Lurker wrote:

It's all about the geometery of the frame. Ive heard them referred to as 'boring' because it is more stretched out than bigger travel hardtails - very comfortable, but doesnt feel as 'chuckable' as 'All Mountain bikes' like an Orange Crush, Ragley Piglet or Saracen Zen for example. (I use them as examples as that is what my mates ride, so what i have ridden on.) With those you feel more on-top of the bike, very easy to bunny-hop etc. They also feel safer going down steep trails as you seem to be able to shift your weight better over the bike. You don't get that range of movement when you are more stretched out over the frame. (At least that is my and my mates opinions).

It's not a description I would use - i would call it neutral. It's not a bad thing if your rides necessitate it - if I'm doing a 30 mile ride up and down a walking trail in Northumberland my mates are struggling, whereas I'm flying.
I'm riding a 20" frame, but could have dropped to an 18" to get a more chuckable feel. I think it would have worked, it just wasn't for me. Give it a go - the geometry on all of the Cube hardtails feel very similar, so if you are good on one, you will be good on the rest.

Long Time Lurker, how tall are you? Im 5.7, inseam 30 and i think to get an 18!

Long_Time_Lurker

6ft 1", 32" leg (stumpy legs, long body).
Reckon the 20" would be too big for you.

rockmonkeysc

SRAM transmission isn't as good as Shimano but I have got SRAM X0 on one of my bikes and it's not too bad.

Vladislav

Long Time Lurker wrote:

6ft 1", 32" leg (stumpy legs, long body).
Reckon the 20" would be too big for you.

yeah its typical! im between sizes 16 and 18!

Long_Time_Lurker

You would probably find that both will fit. Just make sure you don't buy too big. It's easier to make a small frame fit with longer seatposts etc, but if it is too big, you can't do anything.

Do you have the chance to sit on them?
I could tell straight away that the 18" was too small, before I even took it out of the shop for a test run.

(And I'm with RockMonkey - I prefer Shimano to SRAM, but it would never be the deciding factor in me buying the bike. They both work well, I just find Shimano easier to adjust and fix - but that could just be because the majority of bikes that I have owned have come with shimano kit.)

Vladislav

Long Time Lurker wrote:

You would probably find that both will fit. Just make sure you don't buy too big. It's easier to make a small frame fit with longer seatposts etc, but if it is too big, you can't do anything.

Do you have the chance to sit on them?
I could tell straight away that the 18" was too small, before I even took it out of the shop for a test run.

No i will have to order online from them, its way too far from me. I dont really care about standover clearance, dont think it matter nowdays isnt it? they only thing im concerned about is handle bar reach. Ive been reading a lot of info online about it, and according to that page here:

http://www.bikeradar.com/gear/article/t ... fit-29498/

it shoud be all right!

"A guideline for saddle to handlebar reach is to put the tip of your elbow on the nose of the saddle and see how far your longest finger reaches along the stem; forearm length is generally a good indicator of full arm and torso length. Most riders looking for a fast and efficient trail riding posture will discover that their longest finger reaches to almost exactly halfway between the steerer top and the handlebar centre."

So i know cube 18" got 416 mm reach, and i measured my forearm length and its around 410-420 mm, so it looks like should fit!
Few sites also saying that if you are in between sizes its a matter of preference, smaller for more technical stuff, and bigger for more comfortable riding position, i tend to think that i more prefer comfortable position.
Oh well, i guess we will see good luck to me

Long_Time_Lurker

Reckon that both will be ok. If I was you, I would be going for the 18" too. Neither the 16 or 18 should be too big that it is uncomfortable to ride.

Vladislav

Long Time Lurker wrote:

Reckon that both will be ok. If I was you, I would be going for the 18" too. Neither the 16 or 18 should be too big that it is uncomfortable to ride.

Thanks for all your help I just need to press that buy button, damn its not so easy i would say, even after 30% discount bike is still a hell of a lot of money

The Rookie

At below average height, a small rather than a medium would seem to make sense?

I'm 5'10" and ride a 16" as I prefer a more nimble feeling over the 18" medium that would be more normal at my height.

Vladislav

The Beginner wrote:

At below average height, a small rather than a medium would seem to make sense?

I'm 5'10" and ride a 16" as I prefer a more nimble feeling over the 18" medium that would be more normal at my height.

are you riding a cube as well? some manufacturers 16" is like some others 18" and vice versa

The Rookie

I agree no two 16" are the same, no I'm not riding a cube though although the Canyon sizing programme suggests I buy a 16.5" Canyon.

At your height I'd suggest an 18" is a bit big.

kammybear

I'm a big fan of cube...mainly cos I like the look of them! I've had an attention and currently an ltd pro29 and hope to get a carbon reaction one day soon! I use mine at Cannock chase all the time. Only on the dog so far and it's awesome!

Get the most expensive reaction you can afford!

Vladislav

kammybear wrote:

I'm a big fan of cube...mainly cos I like the look of them! I've had an attention and currently an ltd pro29 and hope to get a carbon reaction one day soon! I use mine at Cannock chase all the time. Only on the dog so far and it's awesome!

Get the most expensive reaction you can afford!

Do you think carbon got an advantage over alu 7005? at paulcycles its about for the same price you can get Alu 7005 Cube Reaction as well as GTC Carbon.

kammybear

From what I understand carbon bikes actually feel different as well with the vibrations coming through ie a lot less?

If its the same price, I'd try out carbon

cooldad

Depends. Carbon can be made very stiff, aluminium can be made 'soft'. Depends on the design etc.

Vladislav

The Beginner wrote:

At below average height, a small rather than a medium would seem to make sense?

I'm 5'10" and ride a 16" as I prefer a more nimble feeling over the 18" medium that would be more normal at my height.

Yeah good point! Anyway, yesterday i had a chance to sit on a few Cubes and even have a spin in the car park, but its not the model that i want to get still. But here is my thoughts:
I tried 18" Cube Aim Disc (545mm top tube, 572mm top tube horizontal, am i right that those two measures the most important on a MTB?), and it was good.
Also i tried Cube LTD SL 16" (top tube 535mm, 556mm horizontal) and it was a little bit small.

So looks like the answer is easy and i need 18? No! i came back and check online geometry of the Cube Reaction GTC that i want to get and its size 16" (545mm and 570mm) is basicly the same as Aim 18" which fits me. However Seat tuibe is still 4-5 cm smaller on a 16" GTC.
So my question is, am i right that if i felt Aim Disc 18" good, then Reaction GTC i need as 16"?? (Coz reaction gtc 18" is 1.5 cm bigger top tube than 18" Aim)
Oh damn sizes!

b45her

RockmonkeySC wrote:

SRAM transmission isn't as good as Shimano but I have got SRAM X0 on one of my bikes and it's not too bad.

i find the opposite, the sram kit i've had has been pretty much fit and forget, maybe change the cables every few months.
shimano on the other hand has always required constant adjustment, cable cleaning and replacement just to stay working properly also the slightest bit of mud on the rear mech renders them almost useless.
shimano do make much better BB's though.

Vladislav

The Beginner wrote:

At below average height, a small rather than a medium would seem to make sense?

I'm 5'10" and ride a 16" as I prefer a more nimble feeling over the 18" medium that would be more normal at my height.

I finally got my cube reaction! and you been right, 16 size was the way to go for me (5.7 , inseam 30), im feeling comfortable, reach is perfect, stand over clearance perfect!
However, to achieve a slightly bent position for my leg, i had to pull the saddle slightly above handlebar level, and its got about only 1 cm off the point of limit, i guess its still normal?? apart form that, bike feels perfect and comfy.

Also there is one little thing that i would like to ask, my front wheel makes a bit of a noise(metal sound) when im riding, its probably something connected with the brakes? any ideas how to fix it? Thanks

Long_Time_Lurker

Does it happen when you are riding in specific conditions, or is it all of the time? Dirt and grit in the brake may cause that noise temporarily.
Or it could be brake rub. Lift the front wheen off of the floor and give it a spin - does it keep spinning or slow down quicker that expected?
If it is, the easiest/quickest thing to do, is to loosen the quick release skewers and retighten them, they may be tighter on one side than the other. If it is too tight on one side, it may push the wheel slightly left or right, bringing the brake pads into contact with the brake rotor.

If it isn't that you may have to tweak the brakes. Check the Park Tools website. They have tons of videos explaining every maintenance job you would want to do to a bike.

Vladislav

Long Time Lurker wrote:

Does it happen when you are riding in specific conditions, or is it all of the time? Dirt and grit in the brake may cause that noise temporarily.
Or it could be brake rub. Lift the front wheen off of the floor and give it a spin - does it keep spinning or slow down quicker that expected?
If it is, the easiest/quickest thing to do, is to loosen the quick release skewers and retighten them, they may be tighter on one side than the other. If it is too tight on one side, it may push the wheel slightly left or right, bringing the brake pads into contact with the brake rotor.

If it isn't that you may have to tweak the brakes. Check the Park Tools website. They have tons of videos explaining every maintenance job you would want to do to a bike.

Thank you very much. that noise is all the time, and yeah it looks like brake pads making a contact with brake rotor, will try to loosen the quick release skewers.
What about my hight of the seat post? there is a marking from Point of Limit (0) to 10 cm on my seat post, (highest and lowest points) and my current hight is that i can see number 1, and it means that only 1 cm down that line is a limit how high you can pull it out safely. I guess its still ok? still within limits