Have I been had? Fake or Genuine 3T Bars
Comments
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upperoilcan wrote:Ebay is a minefield..
If it's too good to be true then it usually is...
You are right. eBay can be great but you do need to be very careful. I have saved far more money than I have lost as a result of using eBay but I have been scammed a couple of time. That is just a cost of using it.
Some products are fairly easy to produce fake copies of and carbon bike bits appear to be one example. Having said that, there are perfectly reputable Chinese sellers producing decent quality carbon framesets and wheels at a very good price who trade through eBay. You do need to be very careful with branded products though.
The fact is that eBay's buyer protection is not as strong as it should be. It's impossible for them to police every listing but they do make unreasonable demands on the buyer if you have been scammed by a fake product. I bought an Apple branded laptop battery on eBay. As soon as I opened it I realised it was fake because it weighed far less than the genuine one (ie fewer cells inside) but eBay insisted I get an expert report to prove it was fake. However, in my experience, most sellers will accept a return ("I didn't know it was fake, I'm sorry" yeah right) but you often have to pay P&P so you are out of pocket.0 -
It would be useful to know what products it is possible to fake with a reasonable degree of convincingness. The scary thing about those bars is that if they had used the correct colours for the LTD model it would have been very difficult to tell they were fake, other than perhaps by the weight. Sometimes I almost get the impression that some of the Chinese fakes are deliberately made to be slightly different from the originals so that there is an implicit admission that they are copies even if it is not stated as such. Perhaps some subtle Chinese cultural tradition in trading? But clearly there must be plenty of fakes where you really wouldn't be able to tell just by examining them.
I assume that it would be next to impossible to fake most groupset components convincingly because they are too complex and with too many parts. Carbon frames, bars, stems, seatposts etc obviously can be faked pretty easily. How about wheels?0 -
Can one of you send me (if appropriate) any details about this admission? I bought a Bontreger carbon post from him and whilst I haven't lost out much cash I'd be interested to see what he said about getting them made.Whosthedaddy wrote:mallorcajeff wrote:this sounds very much like the same seller a friend of mine bought a "ritchey carbon" post from a few weeks ago only for it to snap mid ride clena in half. got a refund after threatening legal action. denied knowing they were fake etc but when you dig a bit deeper had sdmitted he was having them made and badged as ritchey. i dont buy anything carbon off ebay. cant remember the id of the guy but it was something simple like bike spares or bikeparts or something.
Was known as caddygolf11, but changed to Bikebits201212
I've got to say that after looking at the same part in a shop and then at what I received I can't tell the difference at all (although I didn't have them side-by-side at the time admittedly). It looks very well made and has definitely made a difference to the ride quality on my Al frame's bike. That said, I don't want to risk the post breaking mid-ride obviously, or encourage the sale of fake goods.0 -
rich164h wrote:
Can one of you send me (if appropriate) any details about this admission? I bought a Bontreger carbon post from him and whilst I haven't lost out much cash I'd be interested to see what he said about getting them made.Whosthedaddy wrote:mallorcajeff wrote:this sounds very much like the same seller a friend of mine bought a "ritchey carbon" post from a few weeks ago only for it to snap mid ride clena in half. got a refund after threatening legal action. denied knowing they were fake etc but when you dig a bit deeper had sdmitted he was having them made and badged as ritchey. i dont buy anything carbon off ebay. cant remember the id of the guy but it was something simple like bike spares or bikeparts or something.
Was known as caddygolf11, but changed to Bikebits201212
I've got to say that after looking at the same part in a shop and then at what I received I can't tell the difference at all (although I didn't have them side-by-side at the time admittedly). It looks very well made and has definitely made a difference to the ride quality on my Al frame's bike. That said, I don't want to risk the post breaking mid-ride obviously, or encourage the sale of fake goods.
The seller has never admitted to me that they are counterfeit.
I emailed to tell him the bars that he had sold to me were counterfeit and his reply was
"I am very sorry about that I bought these as a Job lot at a local auction house in Belfast. I am more than happy to refund you in full, could you please return them "0 -
Just started dispute resolution with ebay - I purchased a "ritchey carbon" post at the end of Dec thankfully not yet fitted it yet. Suspect that Bikebits201212 will soon be shutting up shop on ebay, still should get the money back one way or another - if its "too good to be true it probable is".0
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Informed I-Ride (3T Agents in the UK)
Have told the seller that I want a refund before I return as my purchase is way outside the 45 day window.
Possibly kissed goodbye to ever getting a refund, but you never know.
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But is looks like he has admitted this at some point. Mallorcajeff said "when you dig a bit deeper had admitted he was having them made and badged as ritchey."Whosthedaddy wrote:rich164h wrote:
Can one of you send me (if appropriate) any details about this admission? I bought a Bontreger carbon post from him and whilst I haven't lost out much cash I'd be interested to see what he said about getting them made.Whosthedaddy wrote:mallorcajeff wrote:this sounds very much like the same seller a friend of mine bought a "ritchey carbon" post from a few weeks ago only for it to snap mid ride clena in half. got a refund after threatening legal action. denied knowing they were fake etc but when you dig a bit deeper had sdmitted he was having them made and badged as ritchey. i dont buy anything carbon off ebay. cant remember the id of the guy but it was something simple like bike spares or bikeparts or something.
Was known as caddygolf11, but changed to Bikebits201212
I've got to say that after looking at the same part in a shop and then at what I received I can't tell the difference at all (although I didn't have them side-by-side at the time admittedly). It looks very well made and has definitely made a difference to the ride quality on my Al frame's bike. That said, I don't want to risk the post breaking mid-ride obviously, or encourage the sale of fake goods.
The seller has never admitted to me that they are counterfeit.
I emailed to tell him the bars that he had sold to me were counterfeit and his reply was
"I am very sorry about that I bought these as a Job lot at a local auction house in Belfast. I am more than happy to refund you in full, could you please return them "0 -
Let 3T worry about their own IPR, you focus on your money. Send them pictures of the bars and ask them to comment, they will probably want details of the seller.
If you have the seller name and address then see what info you can dig up on him.0 -
Just received this reply - the address below is different to the one on the ebay site - could be genuine!!!!!!
Hello
Sorry for the late reply, I stand by everything that I sell and try my best to resolve any issues. I have had no buyers telling me that the seatposts I sold them have snapped. I am not going to mess you about and if you please return the item to me I will refund you once received and of corse cover the return postage costs. Can you please return to
Regards
Antony0 -
Whosthedaddy wrote:Informed I-Ride (3T Agents in the UK)
Have told the seller that I want a refund before I return as my purchase is way outside the 45 day window.
Possibly kissed goodbye to ever getting a refund, but you never know.
I would say it is highly unlikely they will refund the money first. After all, what is to stop you just keeping them and the money? Also, eBay requires that you return the goods before they will instruct a seller to refund so make sure you get proof of posting.0 -
cmb wrote:Just received this reply - the address below is different to the one on the ebay site - could be genuine!!!!!!
Hello
Sorry for the late reply, I stand by everything that I sell and try my best to resolve any issues. I have had no buyers telling me that the seatposts I sold them have snapped. I am not going to mess you about and if you please return the item to me I will refund you once received and of corse cover the return postage costs. Can you please return to
Regards
Antony
This response reminded me of something..... Once upon a time, before I became aware of ebay counterfeiting I bought a seat post... After I contacted him, telling him it was fake, Look at the response I got..
"Hello
Firstly let me apologise about this, unfortunately my knowledge of bicycle brands / parts is not very good. I bought these items as a job lot at a local auction house.
Sending the item back for a full refund is no problem at all and I will certainly cover the return postage costs. If you could just return it to the return address on the package that would be great. I will let you know once received and process the refund plus the return postage costs ( could you send it recorded? Keeps us both right )
Once again my apologies for any inconvenience caused
Thanks
Antony"
This guy is clearly praying on the people who are not going to realise that he is selling counterfeit product & make a profit on it.Bikes:
Felt F2 Di2 [2012]
Verenti Millook0 -
Ebay is awash with counterfeit goods,nothing is sacred.
Ebay really is not the place it started out as,I know people who have bought golf clubs cheaper than retail,who have used the clubs then taken them in to be re gripped only to find that they have been ripped off due to the set being copies..
Problem is these days that the copies are so good it really is a job in itself to notice the difference.
I personally only use Ebay to buy used lake balls for golf.I certainly wouldnt dream of buying anything of particular value from the site having the mind set that what im buying may well be a copy.
Not worth the risk.
Having read that someone has bought a carbon seat post only to find that after use it has snapped really just drives it home that not only have you been ripped off due to the item being a copy and made on the cheap,it also has very worrying safety implications.Cervelo S5 Ultegra Di2.0 -
lotus49 wrote:Whosthedaddy wrote:Informed I-Ride (3T Agents in the UK)
Have told the seller that I want a refund before I return as my purchase is way outside the 45 day window.
Possibly kissed goodbye to ever getting a refund, but you never know.
I would say it is highly unlikely they will refund the money first. After all, what is to stop you just keeping them and the money? Also, eBay requires that you return the goods before they will instruct a seller to refund so make sure you get proof of posting.
My money has been returned prior to me sending the bars back
So I'm grateful for the seller doing that
This is closure for me and lesson learnt
Thank you all again for your help.
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For me, I've used the part now so even if it is fake I can't really send it back and expect a refund. I'll take it to a Trek dealership and ask them to take a look at it to make a definitive assessment of whether or not it's fake (I assume it is from this thread), at least I've not lost much money and whilst not original, if it is fit for being used then I can continue to use it. I guess that just because something isn't real doesn't by default mean that it's structurally unsound, in fact it could be stronger than the original and possibly heavier as a result! Certainly the part looks well made and substantial and after a few rides there's nothing to suggest that it's weak in anyway but it has improved the ride quality of the bike. I'll see what the dealer says and go from there.
It's a shame actually as it if was an unbranded part (along the Chinarello lines) I'd probably be quite happy to pay for it and take a punt on how strong it is in the long term. It's just that the question of authenticity also puts other concerns into your mind. Strange thing psychology!0 -
The fact that you used them is not really relevant to the breach of contract. It sounds to me that you just want a bit of money back for the fact its not genuine.0
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Bought a fake Ritchey WCS stem from this guy. He gave the same copy and paste explanation/apology ("Firstly let me apologise about this, unfortunately my knowledge of bicycle brands / parts is not very good") to me just now. Total BS!
Same address as the one originally posted in this thread. (But now removed)0 -
Not at all to be honest. Maybe I should feel that way but for the amount that I paid I'm quite happy to let it go and put it down to a case of "buyer beware". It's not worth the hassle of shipping/packaging and the time to deal with all of that. Fortunately I won an auction which finished at an odd time of day so no-one else was bidding. I'd seen identical items from the same seller going for 4-5 times what I paid!! I would be feeling rather different if that was the case.diy wrote:The fact that you used them is not really relevant to the breach of contract. It sounds to me that you just want a bit of money back for the fact its not genuine.
As I said, what I have got is a carbon seatpost and it's actually unfortunate that it's branded Bontreger as if it was non-branded and for sale for what I paid, I'd probably have taken a punt on it anyway in much the same way that people buy unbranded Chinese carbon frames and wheels. I certainly didn't buy it because it was a bontreger part and I wanted it labeled as such. I bought it because it was light and got good reviews and should add some comfort to my otherwise incredibly stiff alloy BMC bike instead of the alloy post it was going to replace. Regardless of whether it's real or fake, it does appear well made and the ride quality is significantly improved. Yes, there's a slight concern about the safely aspect, but that's no different to the chinarello case, also warantee'd or not, if a genuine part broke that led to serious injury, being able to claim a new part as a replacement is hardly going to be at the front of my thoughts.
As things stand I'll take it to a shop to see once and for all if it is fake, and then keep riding it and see how I get on. If it is fake, and it's looking increasingly like that is the case, I certainly wouldn't be trying to pass it off as something it isn't if anyone asks me, and I certainly won't be buying from that seller again.0 -
i been reading this thread with some interest and glad you got your money back. its exactly why i dont trust ebay and spend that little bit more for a bit of piece and mind knowing the product is genuine.0
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Just seen this thread pop up again and it was bike bits on eBay that sold the seat post to my mate. Totally fake richey post and seriously dangerous. The guy will kill somebody one day peddling 5hite like that. He got the same response as you all did too. I think we shoulda all do a group buy, buy everything he has got and then fail to pay. Could be a fun game everything he lists something we bid it up to a grand a keep going then leave it. Anyone know his current Id?0
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bikebits201212. Is this guy if so there are a lot of gullible people out there.Smarter than the average bear.0
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Yes I've certainly given up looking for nearly new used bike parts on ebay. The problem you have is you may end up buying from someone who buys a fake and the sells it on unknowing. The thing with fakes is they may be good quality or they may be junk, if they had their own brand, they would start to gain a reputation for quality or otherwise.0
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When I bought from Anthony/Tony he was using the eBay id hambers111. I refused to return the stem to him, and told him to refund. He refunded last night from the hambers111 account.
His excuses of ignorance don't stack up, he clearly has been involved in the bike business some some time. I suspect he has owned an actual shop at some point.
I'm reporting him to Trading Standards here in Belfast. Email me if you want me to pass on the details of anyone else that's bought from him.0 -
I assume you have passed the stem to the authorities?0
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mallorcajeff wrote:Just seen this thread pop up again and it was bike bits on eBay that sold the seat post to my mate. Totally fake richey post and seriously dangerous. The guy will kill somebody one day peddling 5hite like that. He got the same response as you all did too. I think we shoulda all do a group buy, buy everything he has got and then fail to pay. Could be a fun game everything he lists something we bid it up to a grand a keep going then leave it. Anyone know his current Id?
Almost bought some Ergosum Ltd bars off "Sammysosage". He says they are 200g (should be 174g) and says he is selling them because he has just upgraded. However, look through his feedback and this is at least the 4th set of bars he has used this excuse with! He also admits that the FSA plasma bars he is selling is counterfeit, but don't worry because they are better than the genuine ones!
Can I suggest that we all report ebay counterfeit items and their sellers to ebay. Ebay are more likely to act if there are more of us reporting it.
Use this link to report it.
http://ocs.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll? ... 0an%20item0 -
diy wrote:I assume you have passed the stem to the authorities?
I will be yeah.0 -
Wish I'd seen this thread earlier!
I recieved the ritchey seatpost, and the clamp was faulty. I contacted the seller, who asked me to return it and agreed to send a new one out. The seller recieved it last week (recorded delivery) and has dropped off the face of the earth. I have emailed through Ebay and had no repsonse. A friend messaged him earlier with a question about another item for sale and he replied withing a few minutes, so I know he must be recieving the messages!.
On top of this, I was a bit suspect about the post as the quality control on it seemed rather low.
Don't really know where to go from here. I have no seatpost and no recourse!.
A bit disappointed to put it mildly!
Any suggestions?
Regards
Carl0 -
You can and should lodge a complaint with eBay asap but if that doesn't work, you may still have recourse through your credit card issuer assuming you did use a credit and not a debit card.0
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lotus49 wrote:You can and should lodge a complaint with eBay asap but if that doesn't work, you may still have recourse through your credit card issuer assuming you did use a credit and not a debit card.
Depends if he paid via Paypal. If so, the introduction of a third (er, fourth) party means that a credit card won't help you.0 -
@ Carl, what is the seller's eBay ID?0
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Hi.
The seller contacted me, informing me he had just come out of Hospital on Wednesday, and hadn't had a chance to post or offer me a refund. He did find the time to reply to my mate though!.
He has now issued a full refund.
However, it had not occurred to me that the Seatpost might be fake!. Had I done any research prior to purchase, I would have found the page from the Ritchey website, where there is a recall on the 27.2 version of the seatpost he is selling. The recall was about 2 years old, so either the posts are faulty, or counterfeit.
It IS the same seller as mentioned here, based in N.Ireland. Looks like he trades under a few different names.
However, while he should not be selling stuff if it is fake, I have to say, he is very polite about it!
I will not be buying any more carbon stuff through ebay.
Regards
Carl0
