Continental gator skins

sigorman85
sigorman85 Posts: 2,536
edited January 2013 in Road buying advice
Thinking about getting a set of these are they worth the money?
Cheapest I have seen them are 24.99 each in my lbs
When i die I just hope the wife doesn't sell my stuff for what I told her I paid for it other wise someone will be getting a mega deal!!!


De rosa superking 888 di2
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Comments

  • ilm_zero7
    ilm_zero7 Posts: 2,213
    no - 4 seasons are a much better bet
    http://veloviewer.com/SigImage.php?a=3370a&r=3&c=5&u=M&g=p&f=abcdefghij&z=a.png
    Wiliers: Cento Uno/Superleggera R and Zero 7. Bianchi Infinito CV and Oltre XR2
  • Ber Nard
    Ber Nard Posts: 827
    They're not that bad depending on what you want from them. I have a pair and so far they seem to be incredibly hard wearing (the centre strip of rubber from the mould is still visible), haven't punctured (will now) and there are no cuts on either tyres. I've put a fair few miles on them, too.

    Their fatal flaw is wet weather grip: it's all but non-existent. Uphill they spin, under braking they lock up far to readily. Cornering doesn't seem that bad, though I don't risk pushing them.

    If you don't ride in the rain they're fine. If you do, look else where. I am.

    Rob
  • JamesB
    JamesB Posts: 1,184
    Their fatal flaw is wet weather grip: it's all but non-existent. Uphill they spin, under braking they lock up far to readily

    sorry have to disagree (using 28 mm wired bead g`skins). I`ve fitted a set, and was expecting that in wet they may slip, but so far no problems. Have used them up steep (16%) slippery roads and they keep gripping; OK they`re not as good as the 4seasons I had but are far harder wearing, after a few hundred miles little sign of wear cf 4seasons which are visibly worn.

    I`d say give tham a go; Wiggle have a good deal 2 tyres and tubes at moment
  • turnerjohn
    turnerjohn Posts: 1,069
    I run a Gator on the rear and 4 Season on the front...Gator is tougher and doesn't wear as fast as 4 Season, but the 4 season grips far better....horses for courses really !
  • Ber Nard
    Ber Nard Posts: 827
    JamesB wrote:
    Their fatal flaw is wet weather grip: it's all but non-existent. Uphill they spin, under braking they lock up far to readily

    sorry have to disagree (using 28 mm wired bead g`skins).

    Fair enough, I've got 23mm folding tyres. I did 30 miles in the rain yesterday and I could hear them 'chirping' on some rough roads riding out of the saddle. And I nearly over shot a junction because the back wheel locked up when I wasn't expecting it.

    Rob
  • eyebee
    eyebee Posts: 257
    I've never had any problems with grip and use them year round. I do have the hardshell version so don't know if there's a difference to regular gatorskins. Wear is excellent and would definitely buy again.
  • ilm_zero7
    ilm_zero7 Posts: 2,213
    a typical BR response then - all shades of grey in the answers to the OP - it depends if grip or thrift are your prime importance. personally I would place grip and staying on-board and stopping above all other factors
    http://veloviewer.com/SigImage.php?a=3370a&r=3&c=5&u=M&g=p&f=abcdefghij&z=a.png
    Wiliers: Cento Uno/Superleggera R and Zero 7. Bianchi Infinito CV and Oltre XR2
  • pb21
    pb21 Posts: 2,171
    I've got a 25mm ultra gatorskin on the back wheel of my winter bike. 600+ miles so far in all kinds of crappy conditions and no punctures and no spills.

    I wouldn't ride them in the summer, they don't give the fasted ride, but for winter I find them ok.
    Mañana
  • northpole
    northpole Posts: 1,499
    Personally, I would stick a pair of Conti 4 Seasons on. Indeed, that's what I've just done!

    A pal who used to have Gators, changed to 4000S which lasted a short time before being binned and has recently switched to Schwalbe Durano Plus which he rates best of the lot. He used to comment on the lack of wet weather grip offered by the Gators. I haven't used them, just passing on comments from someone who has.

    Peter
  • redvee
    redvee Posts: 11,922
    I've ridden Gatroskins for over a year with no major wet weather grip issues other than the usual hazards in the wet. Was going to order more from Wiggle but asked in the LBS and they quoted xx for one and xxx for two, when I bought one recently I paid £23 for one.
    I've added a signature to prove it is still possible.
  • passout
    passout Posts: 4,425
    I have found them slippery in the wet, not awful by any means but there are much better options out there. I like michelins myself.
    'Happiness serves hardly any other purpose than to make unhappiness possible' Marcel Proust.
  • centimani
    centimani Posts: 467
    edited December 2012
    Been a gator user for years...maybe 10 and while they are slippy when new...ive never found them an issue in the wet, other than a squirrely moment on a countryside junction in the wet...and that will have been fuel on the road surface, you get the same with cars, so its not always the tyres that let you down.
    Winter, summer, frosty, wet, dry....ive never had problems worth mentioning. Commuted 1000s miles with minimum puncturing (havnt had a single one in 2012)
    The negatives, they are as said slippery in the wet when new. Just let them scrub up for 100 miles or so, then they're fine. They can cut up a bit as well. Ive had a 6mm cut in the rubber on a nearly new tyre, put some reversed emery tape inside to re-inforce it, it ran fine until the tyre wore out naturally.

    I'm a tightwad in some ways...i would'nt spend money on crap tyres. Gators are a good all rounder, not the best, but fast enough (a lot faster than some apparently), fairly good puncture protection, good mileage, i even use mine on the turbo with no issues.
  • careful
    careful Posts: 720
    Personally, I would stick a pair of Conti 4 Seasons on. Indeed, that's what I've just done!

    A pal who used to have Gators, changed to 4000S which lasted a short time before being binned and has recently switched to Schwalbe Durano Plus which he rates best of the lot. He used to comment on the lack of wet weather grip offered by the Gators. I haven't used them, just passing on comments from someone who has.

    +1 to this. Gators slip a bit in the wet. 4 seasons grip well and have reasonable puncture resistance. With a winter as wet as this one though, the 4 seasons picked up a few punctures from thorns so I fitted Schwalbe Durano Plus which proved to be very hard wearing and no more punctures. Trouble is they really are very heavy so Ive now put Durano on the front (a lot lighter but stll with good puncture protection). I've kept the Durano Plus on the rear as historically most of my punctures have been in the rear tyre. Also I find rear tyre punctures more of a pain to fix than front ones (always end up covered in chain lube).
  • sigorman85
    sigorman85 Posts: 2,536
    Some brilliant advice here guys still not sure what to get as some say they are poor in the wet .well the weather is far from dry in the last month or so I might just risk it and give them ago.its a shame that my lbs don't do a tester on different brands
    When i die I just hope the wife doesn't sell my stuff for what I told her I paid for it other wise someone will be getting a mega deal!!!


    De rosa superking 888 di2
  • pb21
    pb21 Posts: 2,171
    The grip is fine, it may not be the best but unless you are trying to descend something like Alpe d'Huez, fast and in the wet, you wont have an issue.

    The main reason against them IMO is the feel and weight, they are basically a slow dead tyre, at least compared to an open corsa, but you wouldn't ride those in the wet through the winter.
    Mañana
  • I reviewed these for roadcyclinguk.com way back in 2007 that may be of interest as it's still valid today:

    Continental Ultra Gator Skin clincher tyre

    If you include their predecessor then I have personally had this model tyre fitted to at least one of my six bikes over the last seven years; most of the time I use 700 x 25 or 28c on my two Audax bikes, one used as a winter club riding and work commute bike, the other saved for longer tours and for summer club riding.

    It is for this style of riding that many buy this tyre, which is designed to give a fast ride with good grip from the light tread pattern and yet still offer a useful degree of puncture resistance. This it achieves with Conti’s full ‘DuraSkin’ sidewall casing and a Kevlar reinforcing breaker layer under the tread. The DuraSkin layer also makes the exposed sidewalls more tear resistant. The tyre’s profile is such that it is often chosen by those who ride a bike with race bike clearances all year round, many choosing to use them during the winter months.

    As I have used them for many years, you can conclude that I must have found then to perform exactly as described above, since that is indeed was that very kind of tyre I was looking for. You would be correct, as I would not continue to use them otherwise. I would also add that I have found them to be durable. So; review done, top marks all round for this tyre then? Well; no!

    Disagreement
    The reason being that I would estimate that there will be as many who disagree completely with my findings as there are those who have found them to perform exactly as I describe. Many users comment that they have not found them at all puncture resistant or durable; they may well give a fast ride and a good level of grip, but so do their summer tyres; if they wanted to live with the punctures they would have continued to use them! So, why have I and many like me found them to be puncture resistant while others have not?

    Well, one reason could be that, being aware that many owners do have problems, I am very strict in making sure that I run them at the correct tyre pressure. Especially on commuting bikes, it is quite easy to allow the pressure to drop slightly without a daily top up. I pay extra attention to this, as I know that those who, like me, have found them to be reliable also make sure that they never let them fall more than a few PSI under the recommended pressure. Another often-heard comment is that many Ultra Gator Skin riders find them to be puncture resistant when new but far less so as the tyre wears down and long before it is worn out.

    I have found this only to a limited extent, mine remaining puncture resistant right up until they are worn to the extent that I would normally be considering changing them anyway. Only when near that time have I found that I got several punctures in quick succession. So, why have I found them durable when others have not? One theory is that, since I have used them on several bikes, on each of which the mileage may be quite low per year, I can get two or three years’ wear out of a tyre. In the past it was common practice to buy tyres well before they were to be used, then store them in a cool dry environment to allow the rubber to mature. It would then become harder and more resistant to punctures. My bikes are stored indoors, so in effect the tyres are also well matured long before they start to get worn down.

    In conclusion, although opinion is divided, I for one will continue to use them as a fast, puncture-resistant and durable tyre, although for sure, now I have said how wonderful they are, you just know that the next time I go out on them……


    Paul
  • sigorman85
    sigorman85 Posts: 2,536
    Thank you for this info Paul
    When i die I just hope the wife doesn't sell my stuff for what I told her I paid for it other wise someone will be getting a mega deal!!!


    De rosa superking 888 di2
  • i have ridden gator, armadillo and the Schwalbe variety all in wet conditions.

    The gator was very slippery. the back wheel locks and slides under slightest moist. but i don't think i had any puncher until one day i went over some pot hole and it cut the tyre in half effectively and i had to replace it.

    the schwalbe was sort of best in terms of grip as it was sticky out of box but i got a lot of punchers with that so I sold them off with my first bike.

    however in terms of puncture proof and durability, the Armadillo was amazing. My back one lasted me nearly 2 years of commute, which now i have replaced with the 4 seasons to try it out. But in the 2 years (20miles a day 5 days a week) i had about 4 punchers, and 2 of those occurred last month as the tyre's rubber was literally running out. the front one is going strong and had probably 2 punchers over the years.

    But the armadillo is HUGELY heavy and it did slip a bit under "emergency" braking in wet and dry conditions, which is why i am giving this 4 season a go on the back end
    Road - Cannondale CAAD 8 - 7.8kg
    Road - Chinese Carbon Diablo - 6.4kg
  • Monty Dog
    Monty Dog Posts: 20,614
    What's a puncher - did you run over a boxer?
    Make mine an Italian, with Campagnolo on the side..
  • passout
    passout Posts: 4,425
    ricky1980 wrote:
    i have ridden gator, armadillo and the Schwalbe variety all in wet conditions.

    The gator was very slippery. the back wheel locks and slides under slightest moist. but i don't think i had any puncher until one day i went over some pot hole and it cut the tyre in half effectively and i had to replace it.

    the schwalbe was sort of best in terms of grip as it was sticky out of box but i got a lot of punchers with that so I sold them off with my first bike.

    however in terms of puncture proof and durability, the Armadillo was amazing. My back one lasted me nearly 2 years of commute, which now i have replaced with the 4 seasons to try it out. But in the 2 years (20miles a day 5 days a week) i had about 4 punchers, and 2 of those occurred last month as the tyre's rubber was literally running out. the front one is going strong and had probably 2 punchers over the years.

    But the armadillo is HUGELY heavy and it did slip a bit under "emergency" braking in wet and dry conditions, which is why i am giving this 4 season a go on the back end

    I agree. It's slippery. Of course it depends what you ride - for me it was it was lancashire fells all year round and they were found wanting on those roads.
    'Happiness serves hardly any other purpose than to make unhappiness possible' Marcel Proust.
  • Monty Dog wrote:
    What's a puncher - did you run over a boxer?


    Big bloke with a huge nail at the end of a baseball bat. Lol terrible spelling indeed. Shit phone predictive text
    Road - Cannondale CAAD 8 - 7.8kg
    Road - Chinese Carbon Diablo - 6.4kg
  • sigorman85
    sigorman85 Posts: 2,536
    Some ppl can't resist to correct
    When i die I just hope the wife doesn't sell my stuff for what I told her I paid for it other wise someone will be getting a mega deal!!!


    De rosa superking 888 di2
  • I've never had a problem with my gatorskins in the wet but you guys are getting me worried now...
  • JamesB
    JamesB Posts: 1,184
    a typical BR response then - all shades of grey in the answers to the OP - it depends if grip or thrift are your prime importance. personally I would place grip and staying on-board and stopping above all other factors

    I think though that a lot of useful info HAS been given, although conflicting !

    Back in Sept I fitted a pair 25mm Conti 4 seasons, at about £33 each. Their grip was great, they felt lively and were a nice tyre to ride. :):) In a few hundred miles I picked up 2 punctures and noticed that tyres wearing visibly, reckon I`d get less than 1500 miles out of them :( .

    Seeing an offer of Conti Gators at £20 each---28mm---decided to give them a spin, even though as Paul Smith says opinions are highly divided on these tyres. I have not found them slippy in the wet at all, I`ve not found that they spin out on hills, under braking etc. I have found that they have had no punctures, are wearing very well and expect >> 2 000 miles, :) and that they are not as lively or as nice to ride as 4 seasons. However at moment they`re staying on, when waether is wet, windy and cold does a slightly more lively tyre really matter ??

    If all tyres cost the same than I`d be riding Vittoria Corsa / Open Paves all the time---but thay don`t and for most cyclists teh thrift / grip issue is a real consideration and from my experience the Gators strika a good balance :)

    I just wonder if the highly divided opinions on Gators is down to tyre sizes and psi used too by each user? Maybe they are more setup critical than a more supple tyre eg 4 seasons ?
  • Mine are all 23mm, hand pumped so about 70psi as my.little pump's seal start to leak air if pressure if higher. So quite low in terms of pressure. Does that give more or less opportunity for punctures?

    Nevertheless, low pressure should mean more contact surface. But the gatot was slippery in the wet - I do my commute in.central London where there are lots of roads with fresh tarmac patches etc. So that might have given me the impression that it is slippery. But it was certainly the least gtippy of all 3 tyres I have ridden.

    I haven't done the 4season in wet yet so can't tell. But I did notice once inflated the 4season is thinner compared with armadillo. Which I didn't notice before when I swapped from schwalbe to arma or gatot to schwalbe
    Road - Cannondale CAAD 8 - 7.8kg
    Road - Chinese Carbon Diablo - 6.4kg
  • andyrr
    andyrr Posts: 1,824
    70psi is too low - try to get these up to closer to 100 - borrow a better pump if need be.
  • paul_smith_srcc
    paul_smith_srcc Posts: 247
    edited December 2012
    We are all different and what is important to each of us can and does vary, it really comes down to personal perception, I know of customers who ride high mileage tours on Schwalbe Marathon plus, one of the most puncture resistant and arguable least 'lively' of all tyres, yet they don't comment how slow they feel, vice versa I know those who ride even further in all conditions on light weight tubular tyres and they tolerate less puncture resistance for a faster set up, what works for them, works for them, they have made their own conclusions and made their own compromises.

    Naturally the two cases above are more extreme, closer comparisons make a difference to many of course, I have had customers buy the Specialized all condition Armadillo Elite tyres for the winter and love them, others have found them hard work and preferred the Gator Skin, quoting that they find them slightly quicker and less puncture resistant, so for them the 'slightly quicker' was a box they wanted to tick more than the 'puncture resistant' box. I use the word 'slightly' with caution as I'm well aware that where one rider swears by a tyre another can swear because of it, no matter how similar the tyres are designed to be, to even it up I've had riders use both those just mentioned and been happy with both.
  • Try the Schwalbe Durano, I've had them on for ~1500 miles with no punctures. They have reasonable to good grip on the wet and roll well.
  • Oxo
    Oxo Posts: 144
    My two-penny worth,

    I've been running Gatorskin Hardshell folding 25mm since early Autumn after ruining a brand new set of 23mm Schwalbe Ultremo ZX's on my local country lanes. Until I'd fitted these, I'd been using Conti 4000S's in 25mm which I'd done a fair few thousand miles on before an increasing numbers of cuts and punctures forced me to change them. Interestingly, my regular cycling partner had been using the 4-Seasons which lasted about the same time as my 4000S's on "our" roads.

    My observations regarding the Gatorskin Hardshells in comparison to my "Summer" tyres would be that:

    - They are heavy, to the point of having their own gravitational field. Wow, could I feel the difference on my regular long climbs. Reflected very graphically on like-for-like Strava segment times.
    - They feel a bit "dead" and "wooden". If tyres were shoes, the GP4000S's could be compared to a nice pair of comfy leather-soled brogues, the Schwalbe Ultremos a pair of lightweight trainers. The Gatorskin Hardshells, however felt like a pair of old Dunlop wellies.
    - They are a bit sketchy in the wet, although it's predictable when you get used to them and can allow for it.

    BUT

    - I've not had one puncture. On the same roads with the GP4000S's earlier in the year, I expected at least one per trip.
    - There's not one mark, cut or blemish on them with regular use since September.


    I've ridden in some truly foul conditions this Winter, to the point that I thought I'd die of exposure if I had to stop to sort a puncture. The Gatorskin Hardshell's haven't let me down. I absolutely love 'em and they are the correct tool for the job for my local roads in Winter. That said, I can't until those balmy warm dry days (!) to go back onto lightweight tyres :)

    Next Winter I may experiment with a Gatorskin Hardshell on the rear and a 4-Seasons on the front for the extra grip - has anyone else tried this?

    Cheers

    Ox
    Sunday Best: 2013 Colnago Master 30th Anniversary
    Foul Weather: 2010 Kinesis Racelight T2
    Commuter: 1958 Holdsworth Zephyr Fixed Gear
  • ADIHEAD
    ADIHEAD Posts: 575
    I've tried the lot and can't fault Schwalbe Durano foldings. Best grip/most comfortlowest wear, reasonable feel. Probably not as fast as GP4 seasons and also bigger per given size though. However, I keep them up to 100psi (25mm) and have never had a Durano puncture. In fact, the only times I've had a GP4 puncture was when they already had plenty of cuts and were about ready to bin anyway.

    A lot of the grip thing is down to rider weight. I found Gatorskins dead and slippy, but I'm under 75kg. The heavier guys I know find them fine.