Pat McQuaid

mike6

iainf72 wrote:

Do we all accept he's got a very difficult job?

Er....No, not at all. He is presumably very well paid to be the un-sackable head of an organisation that is answerable to no one. No shareholders to upset, no order book to fill and then deliver. No customers to keep happy. No pressure to perform.
You tell me what is difficult or stressful about his job? Top hotels, expense account, first class travel, being toadied up to by countries that want in on the world of cycling. I would do it for £1000 a year less than he gets, and probably do it much better, because I care about cycling rather than rather than building my own little empire.

rundle

Don't forget at he lives in a house and drives a car that were paid for in their entirety by the UCI, because Uncle Hein thought it would be good to have Fattie in his pocket.

The simple little fact that the Management Committee of the UCI have never approved those payments is irrelevant, I guess.

No_Ta_Doctor

The first thing that needs doing is putting in place the processes and protocols that ensure that the UCI is open, democratic and accountable. Separate policy-making from the daily work of running the UCI. Make sure that absolutely anything that comes under the heading "doping" is handled as far away from the political level as possible, by established protocols and without possibility of interference.

Then teach the president to say "Doping? That would be an ecumencial matter" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b66SlBA948o

iainf72

mike6 wrote:

iainf72 wrote:

Do we all accept he's got a very difficult job?

Er....No, not at all. He is presumably very well paid to be the un-sackable head of an organisation that is answerable to no one. No shareholders to upset, no order book to fill and then deliver. No customers to keep happy. No pressure to perform.
You tell me what is difficult or stressful about his job? Top hotels, expense account, first class travel, being toadied up to by countries that want in on the world of cycling. I would do it for £1000 a year less than he gets, and probably do it much better, because I care about cycling rather than rather than building my own little empire.

He's got to keep the IOC happy, the national federations happy, the race organisers happy, the teams happy, promote the sport at all level, try to deal with doping with a limited budget and legal constraints, bring in revenue to keep the organisation going. As for being unsackable, he's the elected leader of the UCI - If the committee decide he's not performing they can get rid of him

He doesn't do a great job, but anyone who thinks his job is easy is deluded. I'm not a fan of Pat's at all but I can recognise he's in a crappy position with a tough job.

There needs to be a credible plan in place for the next leadership, not just "get rid of Pat" or we'll end up with something worse.

jawooga

He'll be in post a long time. I should think he's got too much to lose from the truth coming out (allegedly). As has been commented, look at the steely will of Sepp Blatter at FIFA - the best place to avoid conspiratorial charges, is to remain in charge no matter how foolish you look.

mm1

McQuaid was older and knew what he was doing

You mean like carbuncle injecting you know who with...no, that's another thread.

Nick Fitt

jawooga wrote:

He'll be in post a long time. I should think he's got too much to lose from the truth coming out (allegedly). As has been commented, look at the steely will of Sepp Blatter at FIFA - the best place to avoid conspiratorial charges, is to remain in charge no matter how foolish you look.

I think thats bang on. I read an interesting article once that stated that even when the samples show erratic levels that are likely to be doping - or words to that effect, then, the UCI has to decide if there is the likely hood of a positive outcome in a prosecution against the rider. Looking back at lance Armstrong, the US$ pouring into cycling at the time, the strength of the USPS team politically and the fact that every year LA got politically stronger, you can almost believe prosecuting the man was never going to happen. I think that they made an arrangement for lance to go quietly or along those lines. Which he did, unfortunately the suspicions did not and here we are. My guess is the UCI needs to see that (from the case files) they are not overly implicated in a cover up and once they are happy will kow tai to finally sweep the whole thing under the carpet.

McQuaid has until 2013 to achieve this and make everyone of the voters forget about it and move on, congratulating him for his closure skills and commending him as a worthy Chairman, as said, its all politics.

Richmond Racer

Like many of the other posters here I really dont see how McQuaid is going to be got rid of...

Abdoujaparov

If indisputable evidence comes to light that he is heavily implicated in doping cover ups and other corruption, he will go.

Richmond Racer

the thing is that if we're talking cover-ups pre-2006, his excuse would be that Verbruggen was then President...

Nick Fitt

Richmond Racer wrote:

the thing is that if we're talking cover-ups pre-2006, his excuse would be that Verbruggen was then President...

Exactly right Id say. I imagine there are many places to drive the UCI truck through the evidence. Trouble is they have to see it before they can decide which one to go through. They will get away with it though of that I am sure. Unfortunately, its probably better for the sport (which is their ultimate responsibility ironically) if they do get away with it and it is covered up and forgotten once and for all. LA is gone, the books have been written, it is time for all to move on isnt it?

iainf72

It seems Mr Richard Pound doesn't think Pat should have to go.

http://www.velonation.com/News/ID/12997 ... -more.aspx

Or that there should be an independent testing body....

ms_tree

Like Sepp Blatter and the 'young Mr Grace' that used to be at the IoC, you'll have to take a tyre lever to winkle Pat out.

mroli

You couldn't do it with your thumbs and a bit of talc?

RichN95.

There are a lot of people who are clamouring to get rid of McQuaid. If you are, then ask yourself one question. If he quits, then who takes over?

Do you think it will be:

a) A idealistic choice like Kimmage, LeMond or Millar. A boneheaded idea on the intellectual level of saying Simon Cowell should be Prime Minitster

b) Someone from the outside or from cycling's past - Bob Stapleton, Sylvia Schenk - people who have moved on. The best choice - but it won't and can't happen.

c) Verbruggen/McQuaid's choice of a successor - probably Brian Cookson from British Cycling - he holds Pat's old job.

d) Igor Makarov. Head of Russian cycling, UCI management delegate, funder of three teams, billionaire oligarch. A man who will do anything it takes to make cycling Russia's plaything. Do you trust this man more than McQuaid?

So who who is it to be? No question. It will be Makarov, or his puppet (Tchmil). Don't do what Bush did in Iraq and get rid of the leader and then not know what to do next.

ContrelaMontre

I would love to see ASO form a breakaway outwith the auspices of the UCI. I'm sure its gonna kick off after USADA publish their report.

Jez mon

RichN95 wrote:

There are a lot of people who are clamouring to get rid of McQuaid. If you are, then ask yourself one question. If he quits, then who takes over?

Do you think it will be:

a) A idealistic choice like Kimmage, LeMond or Millar. A boneheaded idea on the intellectual level of saying Simon Cowell should be Prime Minitster

b) Someone from the outside or from cycling's past - Bob Stapleton, Sylvia Schenk - people who have moved on. The best choice - but it won't and can't happen.

c) Verbruggen/McQuaid's choice of a successor - probably Brian Cookson from British Cycling - he holds Pat's old job.

d) Igor Makarov. Head of Russian cycling, UCI management delegate, funder of three teams, billionaire oligarch. A man who will do anything it takes to make cycling Russia's plaything. Do you trust this man more than McQuaid?

So who who is it to be? No question. It will be Makarov, or his puppet (Tchmil). Don't do what Bush did in Iraq and get rid of the leader and then not know what to do next.

Agreed, option B is best every time, someone with the requisite skills/experience, but who isn't tainted by already being fairly high up within the UCI. I guess this would be akin to a company flying in a well regarded CEO from a different company when things have gone wrong.

However, there doesn't seem to be a mechanism for allowing/forcing this to happen.

Possibly next best thing to happen would be a breakaway group?

iainf72

I'm not sure I understand why a break away group would help matters at all?

Abdoujaparov

RichN95 wrote:

There are a lot of people who are clamouring to get rid of McQuaid. If you are, then ask yourself one question. If he quits, then who takes over?

Do you think it will be:

a) A idealistic choice like Kimmage, LeMond or Millar. A boneheaded idea on the intellectual level of saying Simon Cowell should be Prime Minitster

b) Someone from the outside or from cycling's past - Bob Stapleton, Sylvia Schenk - people who have moved on. The best choice - but it won't and can't happen.

c) Verbruggen/McQuaid's choice of a successor - probably Brian Cookson from British Cycling - he holds Pat's old job.

d) Igor Makarov. Head of Russian cycling, UCI management delegate, funder of three teams, billionaire oligarch. A man who will do anything it takes to make cycling Russia's plaything. Do you trust this man more than McQuaid?

So who who is it to be? No question. It will be Makarov, or his puppet (Tchmil). Don't do what Bush did in Iraq and get rid of the leader and then not know what to do next.

I'm in no doubt that McQuaid should stay as things currently stand, but surely it seems a little early to be making this judgement! Let's see what the next few weeks and months bring.

thomthom

Of course he shouldn't stay as things currently stand. I know the alternatives aren't that great either but there's no acceptable way you can be in charge of anything with the behaviour that drunk twat and his even drunker mate have shown in the last years.

Get rid.

Abdoujaparov

ThomThom wrote:

Of course he shouldn't stay as things currently stand. I know the alternatives aren't that great either but there's no acceptable way you can be in charge of anything with the behaviour that drunk fool and his even drunker mate have shown in the last years.

Get rid.

We need a bit more evidence first - which is hopefully just round the corner. Then the outcry for his successor to clean up the UCI would be stronger and make it less likely that Tchmil would replace him.

iainf72

Aside from being bad at communicating, what has McQuaid done that's so terrible which would make anyone else a better choice?

Hein I have no time for, but McQuaid inherited a lot of crap from when he was in charge.

andrewjoseph

iainf72 wrote:

Aside from being bad at communicating, what has McQuaid done that's so terrible which would make anyone else a better choice?
...

He sued Floyd for calling him a clown. Now Floyd can't call Pat a clown anymore. That's more than enough in my book!

It's also a shame that Floyd can't state that 'Hein is full of shit'. It's a terribly unjust world.



Apart from that, Pat has been involved in the cover up of bad blood results, possibly armstrong's and definitely contador.

thomthom

iainf72 wrote:

Aside from being bad at communicating, what has McQuaid done that's so terrible which would make anyone else a better choice?

Nah, nothing serious.. Just a bit of covering up dopers here and there, making money on being corrupt, suing people that have/are doing only good for the sport...

Where have you been in the last, say, 2 months?

iainf72

Pat does need to be replaced but until you've got a decent succession plan in place, it's foolish just to boot him out or you'll end up with someone worse.

Whoever replaces him with have to deal with the same system that McQuaid has to deal with. So if you get a big name positive or passport, you'll have the lawyers and finance people telling you to not pursue it. You'll have a shrinking budget, races disappearing, top end of the sport having trouble attracting sponsors, all the other disciplines needing dealing with

Rich is right - if you rush it, you will end up with someone worse in charge.

Jez mon

iainf72 wrote:

Pat does need to be replaced but until you've got a decent succession plan in place, it's foolish just to boot him out or you'll end up with someone worse.

Whoever replaces him with have to deal with the same system that McQuaid has to deal with. So if you get a big name positive or passport, you'll have the lawyers and finance people telling you to not pursue it. You'll have a shrinking budget, races disappearing, top end of the sport having trouble attracting sponsors, all the other disciplines needing dealing with

Rich is right - if you rush it, you will end up with someone worse in charge.

If you have a breakaway group, you bypass the current system to chose a replacement, and the issue of all the other disciplines which IMO would be a clear benefit. With pro cycling, you're always going to get a fight between one hand wanting a clean sport and dopers to be caught, and the other wanting an apparently clean sport, completely free from scandal. However, perhaps a breakaway group could get the balance a bit better.

Of course, a breakaway group does introduce a whole load of other problems and whether it would result in a overall benefit isn't clear.

thomthom

iainf72 wrote:

Pat does need to be replaced but until you've got a decent succession plan in place. Whoever replaces him with have to deal with the same system that McQuaid has to deal with. So if you get a big name positive or passport, you'll have the lawyers and finance people telling you to not pursue it. You'll have a shrinking budget, races disappearing, top end of the sport having trouble attracting sponsors, all the

The thing is.. As long as he is in charge there won't be any 'decent succession plan in place'.

It can't get any worse than it is. McQuaid didn't have a system 'to deal with'. He created that system all by himself. True, races a disappearing - but what did you expect when places like China and Qatar, which give f*ck all about cycling, are - funnily enough - getting all the attention and resources while traditional races with great fan bases are screaming for help.

A man who should be in jail at the moment shouldn't be running the show. It's that simple.

iainf72

Perhaps you should write to the ASO and ask them why they're supporting a race in Qatar then? McQuaid didn't create the system

If Makarov was in charge it would be a lot worse.

And if you suddenly created a void at the top, it wil be filled by something bad. This is a sport where people are in Monaco celebrating Vino at the moment. People like Froome and Gibert - cycling has a long way to go.

thomthom

iainf72 wrote:

Perhaps you should write to the ASO and ask them why they're supporting a race in Qatar then? McQuaid didn't create the system

Eh, Qatar has been given the WC in 2016. A race which is promoted by UCI.

iainf72 wrote:

This is a sport where people are in Monaco celebrating Vino at the moment. People like Froome and Gibert - cycling has a long way to go.

I don't get it. You were the one stating that Pat really hadn't done anything wrong - I would consider that being in same category as the people celebrating Vinokourov.

iainf72

ThomThom wrote:

iainf72 wrote:

Perhaps you should write to the ASO and ask them why they're supporting a race in Qatar then? McQuaid didn't create the system

Eh, Qatar has been given the WC in 2016. A race which is promoted by UCI.

Yes, but it's not like it's the only race in Qatar. The organiser of the biggest race in the sport has a race in Qatar. Why is it ok for them to do it but not the UCI?

I don't think Pat is all innocent, however, he's not the evil mastermind behind everything. It's more important to get rid of Hein. But the IOC have his back so it's not that easy.