Froome
Comments
-
dougzz wrote:Turfle wrote:
They've apparently said (tho I haven't actually seen it) their goal is to win all three GTs in one year. Wiggins the Giro, Froome the Tour, maybe Henao or Uran could win the Vuelta against a weaker field.simona75 wrote:Looking at the strength in depth of Sky could they realistically field two separate grand tour teams in 2013?
Say one lead by Wiggins with Porte, Rogers, Pate, Edvald BH and others, a second lead by Froome supported by Henao, Uran, Flecha and others.
One team does the tour, the other the Giro/Vuelta double.
They definitely have got together a hugely strong GT squad. Even more so if Kiryienka, Cataldo and others come aboard, Suitsou comes back healthy, and Thomas and Kennaugh ride the road.
Seriously? Because surely Wiggins' best bet will always be the TdF while it has more TT Km than the Giro and Vuelta. Also, in pure publicity terms the TdF counts more than the other two combined. Why would he swap for a harder win of less value? It seems very unlikely to me.
The Tour is expected to be very mountainous next year, and if Contador and Andy Schleck are both there it will be very difficult.
I don't believe the Giro would be a harder win. He has shown he's one of the best climbers in the world. He can certainly climb with the likes of Hesjedal, Nibali, Basso, Kreuziger, Scarponi. He has shown it on every sort of climb there is. Wiggins, according to Richard Moore at least, was making noises about the Giro next year.
If they do attempt it, Wiggins Giro, Froome Tour, Henao/Uran/Wiggins for Vuelta seems the best fit imo.0 -
FWIW I agree with this though less WWE and more déjà vu of racing in the late 90s, noughties. Difference being that the Spanish federation make the UCI appear competent. Given the lumps and bumps in their office carpets I don't know how they get about!bockers wrote:All irrelevant IMHO. The tour was largely clean the Vuelta is a drugs paradise as are all Spanish races. Froome has no hope against the 6month wonder Contador. I watch the vuelta as if it were a WWE production.
Listening to commentators speaking in awe at Contador makes me sick.0 -
Turfle wrote:The Tour is expected to be very mountainous next year, and if Contador and Andy Schleck are both there it will be very difficult.
I don't believe the Giro would be a harder win. He has shown he's one of the best climbers in the world. He can certainly climb with the likes of Hesjedal, Nibali, Basso, Kreuziger, Scarponi. He has shown it on every sort of climb there is. Wiggins, according to Richard Moore at least, was making noises about the Giro next year.
If they do attempt it, Wiggins Giro, Froome Tour, Henao/Uran/Wiggins for Vuelta seems the best fit imo.
If Wiggins has showed himself to one of the best climbers in the world - and I agree - then why does it matter if the Tour is going to be more mountainous next year? He won at such a canter this year I can't see him being that afraid of a tougher parcours. Besides which, a tougher Tour is still usually less mountainous than a moderate Giro.
I saw the interview where he alluded to the Giro, but I'm skeptical he meant it. It may seem like a nice idea after the whirlwind he's been in for the past two months, but a few months of reflection over the winter and he'll remember how much more prestigious the Tour is.0 -
afx237vi wrote:I saw the interview where he alluded to the Giro, but I'm skeptical he meant it. It may seem like a nice idea after the whirlwind he's been in for the past two months, but a few months of reflection over the winter and he'll remember how much more prestigious the Tour is.
Plus is there an expectation that the current champion defends his crown, especially in next year's edition?0 -
afx237vi wrote:Turfle wrote:The Tour is expected to be very mountainous next year, and if Contador and Andy Schleck are both there it will be very difficult.
I don't believe the Giro would be a harder win. He has shown he's one of the best climbers in the world. He can certainly climb with the likes of Hesjedal, Nibali, Basso, Kreuziger, Scarponi. He has shown it on every sort of climb there is. Wiggins, according to Richard Moore at least, was making noises about the Giro next year.
If they do attempt it, Wiggins Giro, Froome Tour, Henao/Uran/Wiggins for Vuelta seems the best fit imo.
If Wiggins has showed himself to one of the best climbers in the world - and I agree - then why does it matter if the Tour is going to be more mountainous next year? He won at such a canter this year I can't see him being that afraid of a tougher parcours. Besides which, a tougher Tour is still usually less mountainous than a moderate Giro.
I saw the interview where he alluded to the Giro, but I'm skeptical he meant it. It may seem like a nice idea after the whirlwind he's been in for the past two months, but a few months of reflection over the winter and he'll remember how much more prestigious the Tour is.
Because Contador and Schleck are likely to be at the Tour.
Wiggins is such an odd bird, that it wouldn't surprise me if the idea of trying to get all 3 GTs on his palmares appeals to him more than winning the Tour twice.
Personally I hope he attempts to defend his title, and that Froome is happy to try and win the Giro.0 -
simona75 wrote:afx237vi wrote:I saw the interview where he alluded to the Giro, but I'm skeptical he meant it. It may seem like a nice idea after the whirlwind he's been in for the past two months, but a few months of reflection over the winter and he'll remember how much more prestigious the Tour is.
Plus is there an expectation that the current champion defends his crown, especially in next year's edition?
And most of all, there's an expectation that someone a sponsor is paying a million or two a year doesn't miss the biggest race of the year.Twitter: @RichN950 -
Looking at the TT today with Bertie only 22 secs ahead of Froome - I wonder how much time Wiggins would have taken out of him today if he were there.You only need two tools: WD40 and Duck Tape.
If it doesn't move and should, use the WD40.
If it shouldn't move and does, use the tape.0 -
I find it hilarious that people are saying Froome would have taken chunks out of Wiggins. Wiggins rode the Tour how he had too. He didnt need to attack, why would he risk himself if he could do it at a saunter (which he did), he smashed both TT's and people still dont think he was the worthy winner.
Did Froome not fail in an attack in the Veulta last year.
The same people who said he would win this year are the people who are now plying every excuse under the sun.0 -
Kessiakoff beat Cancellara this year in the Tour de Suisse in a TT on a similar course.Turfle wrote:ThomThom wrote:You have got to be kidding me.
Wiggins pulse didn't hit 70 at any point in the mountains. Had Wiggy-boy been exploited by just a little bit of pressure, forced him from looking away the power meters and actually make him do something he wouldn't have won by that margin on the final TT (A TT he would have had minutes to catch up btw to Froome...) Froome was in top shape in the Tour and is still playing with the biggest boys in the mountainous terrain even though his form is decreasing. Had he been allowed to attack and not holding Bradleys hand, he would have won that Tour De France. Even his thick bird could see that during the race.
Rodriguez, Valverde, and a Contador that can't out TT Kessiakoff are "the biggest boys"?0 -
There's a lot of speculation in this thread. It seems almost received wisdom nowadays to say Froome would not have been able to sustain any attacks he would have made in the TdF, but it's just as much speculation as the opposite.0
-
FJS wrote:There's a lot of speculation in this thread. It seems almost received wisdom nowadays to say Froome would not have been able to sustain any attacks he would have made in the TdF, but it's just as much speculation as the opposite.
Indeed which is why the tour result should be taken as it stands with Wiggins having won.0 -
Internet forum in speculative opinions shock!!!!FJS wrote:There's a lot of speculation in this thread. It seems almost received wisdom nowadays to say Froome would not have been able to sustain any attacks he would have made in the TdF, but it's just as much speculation as the opposite.0 -
simona75 wrote:Looking at the strength in depth of Sky could they realistically field two separate grand tour teams in 2013?
Say one lead by Wiggins with Porte, Rogers, Pate, Edvald BH and others, a second lead by Froome supported by Henao, Uran, Flecha and others.
One team does the tour, the other the Giro/Vuelta double.
They would have to work all of them in a similar way to how they put the Tour squad together which would mean they would struggle to fit in other racing obligations. I think part of the trouble for Froome in the Vuelta in the week ahead could be that Henao and Uran are both more punchy climbers and are not ideal for helping set a hard, steady tempo like Rogers, Porte and Froome (and EBH) did in the Tour whilst Porte started to look tired in the third week of the Tour and has struggled on the Vuelta climbs. Combined with the steeper gradients of the climbs which make the race less controllable than the Tour and fatigue.
With the benefit of hindsight I would say that Froome could have ridden and potentially won the Giro this year with fairly limited support from Henao and Uran but he would not have been as fresh to help Wiggo at the Tour which I suspect was the top task on his job description this year. Uran or Henao could have then led the Vuelta as they are more suited to the types of climb on the race although I don't think either are quite ready to win a GT quite yet.
The problem in going for 3 GT victories for the team is that it means key support riders have to ride hard in 2 GTs and they are likely to struggle.
In most years would a second place finish at the Tour be considered a better result than a Vuelta win? I don't think it would this year as the Vuelta field is quite strong whilst the Tour field was reasoanbly weak but when people look in the history books that is likely to get forgotten.0 -
I fail to understand the surprise from many that Froome isn't leading the Vuelta and winning yesterday's time trial. It was never going to happen, it's damn near impossible to race at peak for 3 straight months. Froome gave his all at the tour in support of Wiggins, and has hardly coasted since.
If Froome hadn't ridden the Tour, no doubt he'd be riding better, and probably be leading the Vuelta now. Wiggins was definitely a worthy winner of this year's Tour, but Sky backed the wrong man at last year's Vuelta. Even after he beat Wiggins in the TT at last year's Vuelta he was still made to ride in support, and ultimately cost him the lost secs and the spot on top of the podium.0 -
Wiggins will try to build the Palmares he wants to and thinks he can achieve. He loves his cycling history and knows he won't win 5 or 7 TdF's. Therefore IMHO he is highly likely to target the Giro or the Vuelta and also why I suggested going for the hour in another thread. He is his own man with quite clear opininions of what he wants to achieve. He just hasn't shared them with us lot.0
-
He's not his own man though. He's contracted to Sky. They pay him a seven figure salary and they want him in the biggest race -the one that Britain watches. Sending him to the Giro or Vuelta would be like them showing the football on Sky Arts 2.morstar wrote:Wiggins will try to build the Palmares he wants to and thinks he can achieve. He loves his cycling history and knows he won't win 5 or 7 TdF's. Therefore IMHO he is highly likely to target the Giro or the Vuelta and also why I suggested going for the hour in another thread. He is his own man with quite clear opininions of what he wants to achieve. He just hasn't shared them with us lot.Twitter: @RichN950 -
RichN95 wrote:
He's not his own man though. He's contracted to Sky. They pay him a seven figure salary and they want him in the biggest race -the one that Britain watches. Sending him to the Giro or Vuelta would be like them showing the football on Sky Arts 2.morstar wrote:Wiggins will try to build the Palmares he wants to and thinks he can achieve. He loves his cycling history and knows he won't win 5 or 7 TdF's. Therefore IMHO he is highly likely to target the Giro or the Vuelta and also why I suggested going for the hour in another thread. He is his own man with quite clear opininions of what he wants to achieve. He just hasn't shared them with us lot.
Could have a good point there. The difference in coverage in the Times of all papers, between the Tour and the Vuelta, is really significant - a couple of inches of daily text. Wiggo has a sky-high (sorry) profile for the non-cycling peeps now. As well as the success story, the Mod gig, the sardonic humour, the everyman thing - all part of the persona. Let's face it, compare his persona to Froome's and the latter has nothing to engage the non-cycling (and some cycling) masses beyond his bike skills.0 -
RichN95 wrote:
He's not his own man though. He's contracted to Sky. They pay him a seven figure salary and they want him in the biggest race -the one that Britain watches. Sending him to the Giro or Vuelta would be like them showing the football on Sky Arts 2.morstar wrote:Wiggins will try to build the Palmares he wants to and thinks he can achieve. He loves his cycling history and knows he won't win 5 or 7 TdF's. Therefore IMHO he is highly likely to target the Giro or the Vuelta and also why I suggested going for the hour in another thread. He is his own man with quite clear opininions of what he wants to achieve. He just hasn't shared them with us lot.
Could easily have the Giro as a target and still ride the Tour. He might not be riding as the main man for GC, but could cover the "road captain" role. The coverage in the press would still be the same, especially if the person he was riding for was a Brit.
It could work quite well as I'd imagine Wiggo could deflect quite a bit of the media pressure/demands from Froome.0 -
hammerite wrote:RichN95 wrote:
He's not his own man though. He's contracted to Sky. They pay him a seven figure salary and they want him in the biggest race -the one that Britain watches. Sending him to the Giro or Vuelta would be like them showing the football on Sky Arts 2.morstar wrote:Wiggins will try to build the Palmares he wants to and thinks he can achieve. He loves his cycling history and knows he won't win 5 or 7 TdF's. Therefore IMHO he is highly likely to target the Giro or the Vuelta and also why I suggested going for the hour in another thread. He is his own man with quite clear opininions of what he wants to achieve. He just hasn't shared them with us lot.
Could easily have the Giro as a target and still ride the Tour. He might not be riding as the main man for GC, but could cover the "road captain" role. The coverage in the press would still be the same, especially if the person he was riding for was a Brit.
It could work quite well as I'd imagine Wiggo could deflect quite a bit of the media pressure/demands from Froome.
I dont think the Great British Public are quite ready for the concept that Wiggo would be riding the Tour and not set up for winning it (let's see how they cope with a smaller race such as the ToB). Certainly not with the mainstream media inc the dear old Beeb still primed to write headlines along the lines of 'Wiggo beaten by his own team mate'...And as for taking some of the media pressure/demands off Froome, hey, Froome wants to be leader, it comes with the territory.0 -
Wiggins will be Sky's man come the next Tour if he wants to be - if he maintains his 2011/12 effort he will still be the strongest guy in Team Sky.You only need two tools: WD40 and Duck Tape.
If it doesn't move and should, use the WD40.
If it shouldn't move and does, use the tape.0 -
RichN95 wrote:
He's not his own man though. He's contracted to Sky. They pay him a seven figure salary and they want him in the biggest race -the one that Britain watches. Sending him to the Giro or Vuelta would be like them showing the football on Sky Arts 2.morstar wrote:Wiggins will try to build the Palmares he wants to and thinks he can achieve. He loves his cycling history and knows he won't win 5 or 7 TdF's. Therefore IMHO he is highly likely to target the Giro or the Vuelta and also why I suggested going for the hour in another thread. He is his own man with quite clear opininions of what he wants to achieve. He just hasn't shared them with us lot.
It's not all one way traffic though. Wiggins has a strong hand of cards himself in any negotiations over racing plans and is clearly one who has to be kept on side to get the best of him.
If they try strong arm tactics, they know they won't get the best of him. I agree there will be pressure but he's not some neo pro about to simply do the job he's told to do.0
