Contador (warning: fan here)

Lichtblick

I'm so glad he's back. Here's why I really like watching Contador.

He brings mountain stages alive. His style, almost dancing on the pedals. I've seen him launch an attack on a steep uphill bend and overtake the opposition on the outside of a steep corner where all the others are clinging to the mountain side kerb. Their faces sometimes say "where did that come from" because they weren't expecting it. I'm sorry, but Froome does not have his easy grace on climbs (it always looks like a grim slog). I'm not old enough to have seen Pantani or Bahamontes. Andy Schleck has some of this but not so consistently (because of continual checking to see how Frank's doing) IMO.

He's so cool while doing all that. No gurning, just a straight face, as if to say "this is what I do, what you got?"

Repeated attacks uphill.

Expertise downhill.

Expertise on time trials even when under immense pressure*.

While still pedalling in burning heat over a suffocatingly crowded mountain top, managed to punch a prat spectator (kitted out as a syringe) squarely in the face and carry on. That was heroic.

*His stoicism when under enormous stress in Astana when LA was there. Also heroic.

Not having met him and never will, for all I know he's dull in real life. Don't care. I think he's superb to watch and I'm glad he's back.

lucan

Almost superhuman innit?

It's almost as if he's on something.

snoopsmydogg

Lucan wrote:

Almost superhuman innit?

It's almost as if he's on something.

*snigger*

got to admit though it was great watching him attacking yesterday, watching the stage was almost better than the whole of this years tdf

twotyred

He's so cool while doing all that. No gurning, just a straight face, as if to say "this is what I do, what you got?"

Not yesterday he wasn't. Looked a lot like suffering through gritted teeth. Maybe he needs a nice steak to keep his strength up.

What's the point of dancing away from the opposition if they catch you up 20 seconds later?

alanjay

I think Inner Ring summed it up yesterday when he said his bark was worse than his bite in stage 3. He is a bit like an annoying yorkshire terrier at the mo..

Lichtblick

So that's four replies so far, three of them sniggering and the fourth is dismissive.

To twotyred's "What's the point of dancing away from the opposition if they catch you up 20 seconds later?"

it seems that even I understand Grand Tour bike racing tactics better than you do.

Hopefully some other posters who also appreciate AC will come along.

greasedscotsman

Lichtblick wrote:

While still pedalling in burning heat over a suffocatingly crowded mountain top, managed to punch a prat spectator (kitted out as a syringe) squarely in the face and carry on. That was heroic.

Do you mean this?



Heroic? Nah, it was funny! But this was funnier!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MV1j_9eL1VM

lucan

Lichtblick wrote:

So that's four replies so far, three of them sniggering and the fourth is dismissive.

Maybe we find it difficult to be impressed by the performance of a drugs cheat.

luckao

Will he be in the Avengers sequel? Maybe he can wear a cape when he rides.

Sgt_Pepper

Lichtblick wrote:

I've seen him launch an attack on a steep uphill bend and overtake the opposition on the outside of a steep corner where all the others are clinging to the mountain side kerb. )

The outside of a steep corner isn't as steep as the inside of a steep corner, he likes to take the easy route to a win in more way than one

ddraver

The Cycling Twitterati have all been fawning over Contador recently - The same people who have been bleating "suspicions" about Wiggins and Froome all year...

Seriously the Doublethink involved there reaches Frenchie Levels of proportion!!

Yellow Peril

Lichtblick wrote:

I'm so glad he's back. Here's why I really like watching Contador.

He brings mountain stages alive. His style, almost dancing on the pedals. I've seen him launch an attack on a steep uphill bend and overtake the opposition on the outside of a steep corner where all the others are clinging to the mountain side kerb. Their faces sometimes say "where did that come from" because they weren't expecting it. I'm sorry, but Froome does not have his easy grace on climbs (it always looks like a grim slog). I'm not old enough to have seen Pantani or Bahamontes. Andy Schleck has some of this but not so consistently (because of continual checking to see how Frank's doing) IMO.

He's so cool while doing all that. No gurning, just a straight face, as if to say "this is what I do, what you got?"

Repeated attacks uphill.

Expertise downhill.

Expertise on time trials even when under immense pressure*.

While still pedalling in burning heat over a suffocatingly crowded mountain top, managed to punch a prat spectator (kitted out as a syringe) squarely in the face and carry on. That was heroic.

*His stoicism when under enormous stress in Astana when LA was there. Also heroic.

Not having met him and never will, for all I know he's dull in real life. Don't care. I think he's superb to watch and I'm glad he's back.

He does have panache, like Pantani but I would say more graceful. I'm not a great fan because of "steak-gate". However, I'm quite excited about this Vuelta and Contador's presence is part of that.

twotyred

it seems that even I understand Grand Tour bike racing tactics better than you do.

Go on then enlighten me. How does being able to distance the opposition by a few metres but then be unable to make it stick good tactics except at the very end of an uphill finish. That's never really worked for the Schlecks either.

No_Ta_Doctor

ddraver wrote:

The Cycling Twitterati have all been fawning over Contador recently - The same people who have been bleating "suspicions" about Wiggins and Froome all year...

Seriously the Doublethink involved there reaches Frenchie Levels of proportion!!

But are they actually the same people? If so then I agree with you.

rick_chasey

He's good value when he's reasonabley evenly matched or not quite in form. If he's really on it he's just too good and chokes the life out of the race.

Not fussed about the doping, though I wish he hadn't insulated my intelligence with the beef story, even just so we'd not have constant appalling beef puns or 'jokes' which are both totally unfunny and totally obvious.

mfin

Ive always said Contador is talented but unfortunately he is also a buffoon/crybaby/liar/idiot when you look at his reactions to getting caught doping.

I also think he's been lucky, lucky to get away so lightly in the last couple of years, and previous DNA stuff conveniently hiding blood identifcation through Spanish law is, well, what do you expect from someone like this.

All that aside, he's a good rider and his attitude to attacking is great. But then again so was LA's.

I find him a source of great amusement, and while Id rather see him out for life, if he's there racing he's there.

Abdoujaparov

I think it's going to take me a couple of years before I can properly appreciate Contador again...or maybe 18 months when he should be returning from his ban.

thomthom

mfin wrote:

Ive always said Contador is talented but unfortunately he is also a buffoon/crybaby/liar/idiot when you look at his reactions to getting caught doping.

The thing is - Alberto has never been convicted for doping.

"the Athlete's positive test for clenbuterol is more likely to have been caused by the
ingestion of a contaminated food supplement than by a blood transfusion or the
ingestion of contaminated meat; "

mfin

ThomThom wrote:

mfin wrote:

Ive always said Contador is talented but unfortunately he is also a buffoon/crybaby/liar/idiot when you look at his reactions to getting caught doping.

The thing is - Alberto has never been convicted for doping.

"the Athlete's positive test for clenbuterol is more likely to have been caused by the
ingestion of a contaminated food supplement than by a blood transfusion or the
ingestion of contaminated meat; "

Okay, getting caught positive and banned then, whichever way you want to put it.

Oh, and the italic bit completely ignores the fact that the blood transfusion angle was not allowed to be explored properly, its part of the complete rubbish around the case. Read up, you'll find that quote does not reflect the fact the case was solely to prove/disprove the meat fairy story that AC presented, and hence the quote is guff as the rest of it wasn't fully investigated, and it was AC's team who seemed to like the idea of stopping these avenues being explored... maybe cos the only way he could have 'got off' was with the Meat story, anything else was a guaranteed ban.

No_Ta_Doctor

ThomThom wrote:

mfin wrote:

Ive always said Contador is talented but unfortunately he is also a buffoon/crybaby/liar/idiot when you look at his reactions to getting caught doping.

The thing is - Alberto has never been convicted for doping.

"the Athlete's positive test for clenbuterol is more likely to have been caused by the
ingestion of a contaminated food supplement than by a blood transfusion or the
ingestion of contaminated meat; "

A complete bodge job by CAS. If you haven't read Ashenden's take on the proceedings then it's worth doing so.

http://nyvelocity.com/content/interview ... l-ashenden

Abdoujaparov

Yep, to cut a long story short Thom Thom, the court wasn't allowed to hear evidence that plasticizers wouldn't normally be found in plasma transfusions. But its statement that Contador probably didn't have a blood transfusion was made largely on the basis that no plasticizers were found in his blood...which of course actually proves nothing.

Such absurdly poor justice it's almost funny.

mfin

Abdoujaparov wrote:

Yep, to cut a long story short Thom Thom, the court wasn't allowed to hear evidence that plasticizers wouldn't normally be found in plasma transfusions. But its statement that Contador probably didn't have a blood transfusion was made largely on the basis that no plasticizers were found in his blood...which of course actually proves nothing.

Such absurdly poor justice it's almost funny.

Just to help Abdou... (as I know where ur coming from but thought the wording was a little unclear).

The key bit in that was in the no plasticizers from the 'plasma' transfusions not the 'full blood' or 'red cell' transfusions... no plasticizers on a certain day was the AC logic of innocence which you can see in the Ashenden piece is not a marker of innocence of the steps of transfusions for blood doping after all.

Blood can be put in, or red cells, that's the performance benefit, but plasma on its own has to be introduced to level out the blood afterwards for the passport etc... all gets very complex when you introduce micro-dosing epo for fooling passport Reticulyte counts and masking agents, diuretics etc etc. (no wonder some 'training programmes' cost a bomb!!)

thomthom

Hey, I never said he didn't do this and that. All I said was he isn't convicted for doping. Which he isn't.

mfin

ThomThom wrote:

Hey, I never said he didn't do this and that. All I said was he isn't convicted for doping. Which he isn't.

Well the Cas ruling was titled:

ALBERTO CONTADOR FOUND GUILTY OF AN ANTI-DOPING RULE VIOLATION BY THE COURT OF ARBITRATION FOR SPORT (CAS): SUSPENSION OF TWO YEARS

It opens with:

Lausanne, 6 February 2012 – The Court of Arbitration for Sport (CAS) has rendered its decision in the arbitration between the World Anti-Doping Agency (WADA) & the Union Cycliste Internationale (UCI) and the Spanish cyclist Alberto Contador & the Spanish Cycling Federation (RFEC): the CAS has partially upheld the appeals filed by WADA and the UCI and has found Alberto Contador guilty of a doping offence.

...so interpret it how you like.

BelgianBeerGeek

Yeah, he was busted, banned, now he's back. No real point arguing the toss.

The thing I don't really get about Contador is: is he quite smart, naive, a buffoon, or a mixture of the three? I really can't work him out, but I'm thinking he's more naive than anything else.

Anyway, he's my GC PTP pick, and it's good to see him back. It got us talking, didn't it?

andrewjoseph

he's a fool who rides on emotion, not tactics.

ddraver

No tA Doctor wrote:

ddraver wrote:

The Cycling Twitterati have all been fawning over Contador recently - The same people who have been bleating "suspicions" about Wiggins and Froome all year...

Seriously the Doublethink involved there reaches Frenchie Levels of proportion!!

But are they actually the same people? If so then I agree with you.

Yep Festina Girl and UCI overlord - both of whom I'm becoming less and less of a fan of...

rick_chasey

ddraver wrote:

No tA Doctor wrote:

ddraver wrote:

The Cycling Twitterati have all been fawning over Contador recently - The same people who have been bleating "suspicions" about Wiggins and Froome all year...

Seriously the Doublethink involved there reaches Frenchie Levels of proportion!!

But are they actually the same people? If so then I agree with you.

Yep Festina Girl and UCI overlord - both of whom I'm becoming less and less of a fan of...

https://twitter.com/SSbike/statuses/234773464920240128

FTW.

inkyfingers

I'd have thought that the one thing that there's no debate about when it comes to Contador, is that he knows how to win races.

andrewjoseph

inkyfingers wrote:

I'd have thought that the one thing that there's no debate about when it comes to Contador, is that he knows how to win races.

yep, through good 'preparation'.

rick_chasey

andrewjoseph wrote:

inkyfingers wrote:

I'd have thought that the one thing that there's no debate about when it comes to Contador, is that he knows how to win races.

yep, through good 'preparation'.

Guys guys guys.

It's pretty simple.

Rather like making sure you don't headbutt people in sprints or cross the line giving a two fingered salute, you make sure you pass the dope tests.

That's all you can do.

Contador didn't and he took time out for it. Now he's back.

This is sport, where rules are arbitrary.

Now, every inverted commas comment on steak, doping, preparation, whatever - we've heard it all before - especially with Contador. Comments like this add no value.

You can generally take issue with dopers coming back, fine, but don't turn every discussion of his road performances into nudges and winks. It's properly boring.