Training ride - felt crap

ishmael
ishmael Posts: 35
edited July 2012 in Road general
OK, From the first hill of a ride I know well and usually enjoy, I feel terrible.

Are training miles always 'good; miles? Should I suck it up and stick to the plan and chalk it down to 'character'?

Or should I accept it's not my day and retire gracefully?

Comments

  • nathb84
    nathb84 Posts: 27
    Suck it up! will make the good days even better.
  • jagx400
    jagx400 Posts: 132
    Struggled myself today, mind I did do 71 miles yesterday, and went to the pub last night for a few. I only had 3 pints but it always messes my ride to work up the next day. Glad i only have 3 pints a week.
    Could be the hot weather, tends to make you lethargic
  • kev77
    kev77 Posts: 433
    I experience good and bad rides, it is all about the rest though as well ;-)

    Do not overdo it
  • VmanF3
    VmanF3 Posts: 240
    Similar here, great ride around London yesterday clocking up over 40m, then today, completely folded on a short climb near home, turned around and freewheeled back after only 8m.

    I'll put it down to the heat......
    Big Red, Blue, Pete, Bill & Doug
  • Blancmange
    Blancmange Posts: 103
    Just keep going. I always find that when I feel useless early in the ride my body will "kick-in" later on. So I
    never give up on the route I'd planned to do, as I would feel I'd let myself down.
    - Slave to the cadence -
  • kev77
    kev77 Posts: 433
    Blancmange wrote:
    Just keep going. I always find that when I feel useless early in the ride my body will "kick-in" later on. So I
    never give up on the route I'd planned to do, as I would feel I'd let myself down.

    this is because you have not warmed the muscle groups up first
  • DavidJB
    DavidJB Posts: 2,019
    Holy crap there's some appalling advice being dished out.

    If you 'feel' crap give up and go home then come back another day. If you're fatigued then have a rest. Over-training is rampant amongst cyclists.
  • BillyMansell
    BillyMansell Posts: 817
    DavidJB wrote:
    Holy crap there's some appalling advice being dished out.

    If you 'feel' crap give up and go home then come back another day. If you're fatigued then have a rest. Over-training is rampant amongst cyclists.
    Also some pretty poor advice.

    There's more to determining over-training than just if you feel crap on the first hill such as checking your resting pulse upon waking to determine if your body has recovered. As has been said, if the first hill is before your muscles have warmed then you'll fell knackered. Continue at a slower pace until you have warmed and if you're still struggling then consider calling it a day but it shouldn't be a given.
  • dodgerdog
    dodgerdog Posts: 292
    The default answer should be "Rules 5 applies!" :wink:

    In reality it may be more an issue of not having built enough rest into your training programme so best to knock it on the head and look forward to a better ride once rested.
    Allez Triple (hairy with mudguards) - FCN 4
    Ribble Gran Fondo
  • danowat
    danowat Posts: 2,877
    DavidJB wrote:
    Holy crap there's some appalling advice being dished out.

    If you 'feel' crap give up and go home then come back another day. If you're fatigued then have a rest. Over-training is rampant amongst cyclists.

    :roll:

    If you feel crap (and it's not illness), then just use it as a recovery ride, active recovery is MUCH better than sitting on your ass.

    Over training is "rampant" really?, which study did you compile to come to this conclusion?, over training is something that happens over months and months, and you REALLY have to be banging in the sessions over many months to become over trained
  • DavidJB
    DavidJB Posts: 2,019
    Fine you keep training on tired legs if that's what you want to do. I prefer to make my sessions count and 'sitting on your arse' is the best option sometimes. Rest is one of the most important parts of training, that's when you get fitter.
  • jgsi
    jgsi Posts: 5,062
    As it was a 'training' ride, you should have gone back down the hill, gone up it in an easier gear, if still the feeling of under 50% still there, go back down again and up again in an even easier gear... if still under 50% . go home.
    Very simple really.
  • danowat
    danowat Posts: 2,877
    DavidJB wrote:
    Rest is one of the most important parts of training, that's when you get fitter.

    Nope, RECOVERY is one of the most important parts (nutrutional being THE most important part), recovery doesn't always mean rest..........
  • DavidJB
    DavidJB Posts: 2,019
    danowat wrote:
    DavidJB wrote:
    Rest is one of the most important parts of training, that's when you get fitter.

    Nope, RECOVERY is one of the most important parts (nutrutional being THE most important part), recovery doesn't always mean rest..........

    Now you're just being pedantic. I'm not going to argue with you. I get very good advice about training and it's working for me. You continue to train how you like I don't really give a rats ass but telling someone to power through when they are fatigued is poor advice.

    All I'll say that since I started training properly and resting (RECOVERING) when my body tells me or preferably before my body tells me has enabled me from placing 20th+ in 4th cat races to winning and being a 2nd cat in a matter of months so I'll let my results guide me on what's the best training rather than someone on a forum. QUALITY NOT QUANTITY.
  • danowat
    danowat Posts: 2,877
    DavidJB wrote:
    danowat wrote:
    DavidJB wrote:
    Rest is one of the most important parts of training, that's when you get fitter.

    Nope, RECOVERY is one of the most important parts (nutrutional being THE most important part), recovery doesn't always mean rest..........

    Now you're just being pedantic. I'm not going to argue with you. I get very good advice about training and it's working for me. You continue to train how you like I don't really give a rats ass but telling someone to power through when they are fatigued is poor advice.

    All I'll say that since I started training properly and resting (RECOVERING) when my body tells me or preferably before my body tells me has enabled me from placing 20th+ in 4th cat races to winning and being a 2nd cat in a matter of months so I'll let my results guide me on what's the best training rather than someone on a forum. QUALITY NOT QUANTITY.

    Blah blah blah.........

    Rest - Recovery, they ARE different, and it pay's to know the difference.........

    Where did I say "power through"? if you'd have read my post, I said "turn it into a RECOVERY ride", which is a long way away from "powering through" :roll:
  • DavidJB
    DavidJB Posts: 2,019
    Anyway back to my original point. If you feel fatigued ishmael take a day off and come back tomorrow.

    Edit: BUT remember to get in a good warm up for 25minutes+ and then decide.
  • cje
    cje Posts: 148
    Go and home and eat cake until it passes.
  • careful
    careful Posts: 720
    Rest - Recovery, they ARE different, and it pay's to know the difference

    Could someone explain in simple terms what the difference is. I understand that a recovery ride is a gentle ride at low to moderate heart rate, but what are the benefits compared to say going for a short walk or even having a duvet day?
  • danowat
    danowat Posts: 2,877
    careful wrote:
    Rest - Recovery, they ARE different, and it pay's to know the difference

    Could someone explain in simple terms what the difference is. I understand that a recovery ride is a gentle ride at low to moderate heart rate, but what are the benefits compared to say going for a short walk or even having a duvet day?

    Increased blood flow to the muscles, which improves recovery (in very simple terms)

    IME, total rest is counterproductive for me for race distances under 100 miles, and I very, very rarely have a total rest day while training.
  • ishmael
    ishmael Posts: 35
    Thanks for the interesting comments. It was very hot and I think that was probably the biggest factor.

    At the moment there is very little structure to what I am doing and I'm just riding miles (35+), mostly early mornings.

    I need a better plan.
  • briantrumpet
    briantrumpet Posts: 20,621
    ishmael wrote:
    It was very hot and I think that was probably the biggest factor.
    I too struggled a bit yesterday in the heat - though the 125 miles might have had something to do with it too. Makes me doubly impressed with how they cope in the TdF in such conditions, as they don't stop for lunch, or at a friend's house for water and coffee, or at a village shop for a sugar fest.
    https://www.facebook.com/unanglaisendiois
  • BobScarle
    BobScarle Posts: 282
    Had to go out tonight to deliver some papers. Took the bike instead of the car (always better) only a little over 20 miles. After a short while I realised that my legs were not up to pushing as hard as I wanted to. Two options, turn around and get the car (no) or carry on at a slower pace. The second option was chosen and I had a nice quiet ride through some country lanes enjoying the sunshine. Got up the hills, slower than usual, in a lighter gear than usual, but I enjoyed the climbs and the whole ride so much more.

    I think that sometimes we get a little carried away with training and average speeds and trying to ride as hard as possible. It is nice just to be out riding a bike. Whether you call it a recovery ride or not. I think we (me included) would do well to remember that.
  • BlakeysFC
    BlakeysFC Posts: 233
    Sorry to hi-jack this thread a bit...

    But I've only been riding my bike since Monday and did almost 6 miles today no problem whatsoever (wasn't even knackered) should I up my training regime to cover more mileage quicker or just stick with my original plan?
  • ishmael
    ishmael Posts: 35
    Well, reverted to my usual early morning ride and the lower temp made a difference. Looking back, I think I was guilty of thinking I was going to rock the course and so set off on too high a pace (for me). Today, I just took it down a bit and relaxed into the ride and enjoyed 35 miles of blissfully quiet country lanes.

    I live in a valley so unless I want to cycle down the A41 to Aylesbury, it's instantly hilly whichever way I go. I naturally pedal a big gear and I find it hard to be smooth at higher cadence, but I am trying to spin a lower gear and arrive at the top of climbs in better shape instead of having veins popping out of my head and leaving a trail of lactic acid on the road.
  • danowat
    danowat Posts: 2,877
    BlakeysFC wrote:
    Sorry to hi-jack this thread a bit...

    But I've only been riding my bike since Monday and did almost 6 miles today no problem whatsoever (wasn't even knackered) should I up my training regime to cover more mileage quicker or just stick with my original plan?

    Depends how hard you are riding those 6 miles...........(but to be fair, 6 miles is little more than a warm up, unless you are riding them at vo2max)

    What is your training "regime", what is you "original plan", we can't comment if we don't know.
  • danowat
    danowat Posts: 2,877
    ishmael wrote:
    Today, I just took it down a bit and relaxed into the ride and enjoyed 35 miles of blissfully quiet country lanes.

    Bingo, much, much better than sitting on your butt.
    ishmael wrote:
    I naturally pedal a big gear and I find it hard to be smooth at higher cadence, but I am trying to spin a lower gear and arrive at the top of climbs in better shape instead of having veins popping out of my head and leaving a trail of lactic acid on the road.

    Work on cadence, it will improve your riding across the board, aim for around a 90rpm avg for a while and see how it feels.
  • BlakeysFC
    BlakeysFC Posts: 233
    danowat wrote:
    BlakeysFC wrote:
    Sorry to hi-jack this thread a bit...

    But I've only been riding my bike since Monday and did almost 6 miles today no problem whatsoever (wasn't even knackered) should I up my training regime to cover more mileage quicker or just stick with my original plan?

    Depends how hard you are riding those 6 miles...........(but to be fair, 6 miles is little more than a warm up, unless you are riding them at vo2max)

    What is your training "regime", what is you "original plan", we can't comment if we don't know.

    Well I'm almost at the end of week 1 of my training regime. The original plan for Week 1 was: 2 x 15-20 minute rides, 1 x 1 hour ride at the weekend.

    But so far this week I've done 4 x 20 minute rides (2 x 2.2 mile rides, 2 x 3 mile rides) and one 30 minute ride (5.7 miles) and am doing one 1 hour (10 mile) ride on Sunday to complete my first weeks training.

    The Plan for Week 2 is 2 x 20-25 minute rides and 1 x 1 hour 30 minute ride. And then Week 3 2 x 25-30 minute rides and 1 x 2 hour ride. But now my training has gone so well in Week 1 I'm thinking about doing 4 x 30 minute rides in week 2 (5.7 miles each) and 1 x 14 mile ride next weekend to complete Week 2. I'm confident that I can do this pretty easily, but I just don't want to burn myself out in only Week 2 of my training regime.

    So should I speed up my regime If I think its achieveable or is it important to build my body up slowly and stick to the original plan?

    I've got a 30 mile sportive on the 30th September which is quite hilly I gather (Cat. 3 ride) which is what all my training is leading upto and will then eventually go on to ensure I can complete 2 further Cat. 3 sportives on the 11th November and 2nd December with ease hopefully.
  • briantrumpet
    briantrumpet Posts: 20,621
    BlakeysFC wrote:
    So should I speed up my regime If I think its achieveable or is it important to build my body up slowly and stick to the original plan?
    Listen to your body, and you'll know. I went from virtually nothing other than short commutes to doing a 109-mile Tour Ride a couple of years ago in the space of about three months (I was 46 then) - there wasn't any plan, other than to get out and ride. If I felt tired then I took it easy, and if I felt full of energy, then I did a longer/harder ride. Take your time and enjoy the rides, and you'll surprise yourself.
    https://www.facebook.com/unanglaisendiois
  • djfleming22
    djfleming22 Posts: 116
    briantrumpet wrote:
    BlakeysFC wrote:
    So should I speed up my regime If I think its achieveable or is it important to build my body up slowly and stick to the original plan?
    Listen to your body, and you'll know. I went from virtually nothing other than short commutes to doing a 109-mile Tour Ride a couple of years ago in the space of about three months (I was 46 then) - there wasn't any plan, other than to get out and ride. If I felt tired then I took it easy, and if I felt full of energy, then I did a longer/harder ride. Take your time and enjoy the rides, and you'll surprise yourself.

    Listening to your advice which i think is quite simple and true and not enough people think about it..... training is all about listening to your body and training well while its in this zone ...when you feel good about getting on your bike your times are good and you enjoy when your tired you look for reason why you have not trained as well as usual and its staring your straight in the face... your a lazy B... no sorry your tired

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