Super Record 2011 vs 2012

markwb79

Hi,

Are there any differences between the groupsets?

From what I understand, the 2012 offers a titanium crankset?

Is there a way of telling the two groupsets apart (serial numbers, boxes?) and is it obvious that it is a titanium crankset if it is not next to the standard or 2011 version?

Thanks
Mark

mfin

I think the Ti crankset has a reverse thread on the bolt that joins the half axles. You should be able to tell by the colour of the Ti too? Haven't seen one, but it might be obvious when you see it.

Can't answer the rest Im afraid, but once the red 11 logo got on there I'm not sure there were differences. Someone will say for sure though in a min.

ugo.santalucia

Off topic, but I am not sure buying a SR 2012 is a good deal... the groupset is going EPS and the mechanical version is obsolete before even being new.
It was silly of Campagnolo to adopt this marketing strategy, but I know people who bought SR 2012 a month ago and are now regretting doing so...

mfin

ugo.santalucia wrote:

Off topic, but I am not sure buying a SR 2012 is a good deal... the groupset is going EPS and the mechanical version is obsolete before even being new.
It was silly of Campagnolo to adopt this marketing strategy, but I know people who bought SR 2012 a month ago and are now regretting doing so...

But EPS costs a bomb in comparison?? ...I don't think electric is making anything obsolete, there will be mechanical versions available for years and years as long as there's demand I'd think.

Also... the current electric groupsets will even become obsolete when disc brakes are added to them, and that's gonna happen soon too.

ugo.santalucia

mfin wrote:

ugo.santalucia wrote:

Off topic, but I am not sure buying a SR 2012 is a good deal... the groupset is going EPS and the mechanical version is obsolete before even being new.
It was silly of Campagnolo to adopt this marketing strategy, but I know people who bought SR 2012 a month ago and are now regretting doing so...

But EPS costs a bomb in comparison?? ...I don't think electric is making anything obsolete, there will be mechanical versions available for years and years as long as there's demand I'd think.

Also... the current electric groupsets will even become obsolete when disc brakes are added to them, and that's gonna happen soon too.

True... even the Record EPS will probably be priced higher than SR mechanical... but...

Re. Disc brakes... yes, they started to appear, but until someone comes out with ceramic discs, the weight problem will always limit their use. I am a fan and I run them on my CdF and can't wait for something hydraulic... we'll see

mfin

I dunno, I think you'll end up with Disc Brakes being widely adopted quite quickly. Of course, if they become allowed in pro tours etc then it'll really catch on big-time. If they dissipate the heat well enough on long descents then they'll catch on.

See even Colnago have announced the C59 with Formula Brakes already.

Something in my mind tells me disc brakes is more of a step forward than electric shifting to be honest.

ugo.santalucia

mfin wrote:

I dunno, I think you'll end up with Disc Brakes being widely adopted quite quickly. Of course, if they become allowed in pro tours etc then it'll really catch on big-time. If they dissipate the heat well enough on long descents then they'll catch on.

See even Colnago have announced the C59 with Formula Brakes already.

Something in my mind tells me disc brakes is more of a step forward than electric shifting to be honest.

my mind and your mind work in the same way, but is it the same way a SR customer thinks? If you buy SR it's not because it's practical but because it's the pinnacle of technology... EPS is the pinnacle of technology...
Disc brakes on road bikes could have been a reality 10 years ago, there isn't any technological challenge to address, it's just lack of will and hampering regulations

2alexcoo

Markwb79 wrote:

Hi,

Are there any differences between the groupsets?

From what I understand, the 2012 offers a titanium crankset?

Is there a way of telling the two groupsets apart (serial numbers, boxes?) and is it obvious that it is a titanium crankset if it is not next to the standard or 2011 version?

Thanks
Mark

As far as I'm aware there's no difference between the 2011 and 2012 groupsets. The Ti version of the crankset has a red logo around the hollow axle. The logo also says 'Titanium Ultra-Torque' rather than 'Ultra Torque System'.

Ti crankset:


Regular crankset:

markwb79

I cant believe I am being off topic on my own thread!

There is no way that I think that EPS has made SR mechanical obsolete. It costs over twice as much, they will keep making mechanical until EPS is close to the current SR Mechanical price point.

If they obsoleted the top end mechanical groupset they would lose quite a few sales I think. Currently it isnt a massive stretch to go to the top end Campag vs SRAM/Shim. DI2 to EPS is a bigger jump.

I can just about justify going from SRAM Red, or Dura ace to SR Mech. But to go to EPS I would have to triple my spend on a groupset.

Thats just my opinion.



Anyway, the difference's between the sets. Anyone else please?

markwb79

Brilliant, thanks alot. I was typing my response at the same time.

2alexcoo wrote:

Markwb79 wrote:

Hi,

Are there any differences between the groupsets?

From what I understand, the 2012 offers a titanium crankset?

Is there a way of telling the two groupsets apart (serial numbers, boxes?) and is it obvious that it is a titanium crankset if it is not next to the standard or 2011 version?

Thanks
Mark

As far as I'm aware there's no difference between the 2011 and 2012 groupsets. The Ti version of the crankset has a red logo around the hollow axle. The logo also says 'Titanium Ultra-Torque' rather than 'Ultra Torque System'.

Ti crankset:


Regular crankset:

markwb79

Sorry another question.....can you tell the difference between the Cult bearings and the standard bearings? To look at I mean?

thegreatdivide

It says CULT down the side of the crank arm.

FWIW - I don't think Campagnolo have made any updates for 2012. You still have two types of SR, one with a Ti crank and one without. There is no real performance difference it's just weight difference - approx 100g with Ti. I went for the cheaper version.

mfin

ugo.santalucia wrote:

mfin wrote:

I dunno, I think you'll end up with Disc Brakes being widely adopted quite quickly. Of course, if they become allowed in pro tours etc then it'll really catch on big-time. If they dissipate the heat well enough on long descents then they'll catch on.

See even Colnago have announced the C59 with Formula Brakes already.

Something in my mind tells me disc brakes is more of a step forward than electric shifting to be honest.

my mind and your mind work in the same way, but is it the same way a SR customer thinks? If you buy SR it's not because it's practical but because it's the pinnacle of technology... EPS is the pinnacle of technology...
Disc brakes on road bikes could have been a reality 10 years ago, there isn't any technological challenge to address, it's just lack of will and hampering regulations

Umm... Ive bought SR in the last month though I might add. I think the only way Id buy electric is if its Campag's or whatever Sram might bring out, probably the former, BUT, it would have to be within say £300 or £400 extra at most, and preferably the same cost for me to go for it.

I agree, regulations-wise. Once we see the grand tours full of bikes on disc brakes, we'll all be on them, they're not prohibitively expensive or anything. Disc brakes do vary so so much though, riding MTBs with lots of different quality/models of brakes shows some to be so so much better in use than other ones, there's no doubt about that.

mfin

Markwb79 wrote:

Sorry another question.....can you tell the difference between the Cult bearings and the standard bearings? To look at I mean?

Im not sure on this... you seem to be asking though as if you're worried though you might get sold something that claims to be something it isnt?? Is this because you're looking to buy s/h or is it cos you're trying to buy somewhere like a shop where you're not sure they might be ripping you off?!

(or is it just out of nothing more than general interest maybe??)

mfin

thegreatdivide wrote:

It says CULT down the side of the crank arm.

FWIW - I don't think Campagnolo have made any updates for 2012. You still have two types of SR, one with a Ti crank and one without. There is no real performance difference it's just weight difference - approx 100g with Ti. I went for the cheaper version.

Is it really 100g?? Crumbs, I thought it was less, perhaps thats why some people can justify the spend if they're looking for the lightest thing out there. (if I was doing that I would have stuck with Sram/DuraAce Cassette n Chain, my levers, rear mech and cassette are now all heavier, mine is a Record Cassette though.)

markwb79

mfin wrote:

Markwb79 wrote:

Sorry another question.....can you tell the difference between the Cult bearings and the standard bearings? To look at I mean?

Im not sure on this... you seem to be asking though as if you're worried though you might get sold something that claims to be something it isnt?? Is this because you're looking to buy s/h or is it cos you're trying to buy somewhere like a shop where you're not sure they might be ripping you off?!

(or is it just out of nothing more than general interest maybe??)

The later, I am buying new. I have been warned off a different shop in the past, reputation for mixing 2011 and 2012 parts. Although I havent heard anything about this shop, nothing but good things actually. It just made me think in general, especially when you are forking out so much! Cables are another good example across all brands.

g00se

mfin wrote:

Umm... Ive bought SR in the last month though I might add. I think the only way Id buy electric is if its Campag's or whatever Sram might bring out, probably the former, BUT, it would have to be within say £300 or £400 extra at most, and preferably the same cost for me to go for it.

Rumours are that campag are bringing out an Athena 11 EPS when the 2013 range are announced (no Chorus 11 EPS). I would guess to compete on price with Ultrega Di2.

rajMAN

Interesting price for Record and Record EPS at Maestro's!

rake

mfin wrote:

ugo.santalucia wrote:

mfin wrote:

I dunno, I think you'll end up with Disc Brakes being widely adopted quite quickly. Of course, if they become allowed in pro tours etc then it'll really catch on big-time. If they dissipate the heat well enough on long descents then they'll catch on.

See even Colnago have announced the C59 with Formula Brakes already.

Something in my mind tells me disc brakes is more of a step forward than electric shifting to be honest.

my mind and your mind work in the same way, but is it the same way a SR customer thinks? If you buy SR it's not because it's practical but because it's the pinnacle of technology... EPS is the pinnacle of technology...
Disc brakes on road bikes could have been a reality 10 years ago, there isn't any technological challenge to address, it's just lack of will and hampering regulations

Umm... Ive bought SR in the last month though I might add. I think the only way Id buy electric is if its Campag's or whatever Sram might bring out, probably the former, BUT, it would have to be within say £300 or £400 extra at most, and preferably the same cost for me to go for it.

I agree, regulations-wise. Once we see the grand tours full of bikes on disc brakes, we'll all be on them, they're not prohibitively expensive or anything. Disc brakes do vary so so much though, riding MTBs with lots of different quality/models of brakes shows some to be so so much better in use than other ones, there's no doubt about that.

they may be expensive at first and then come down.the problem i see with bringing these different systems in as the market share of one type goes down it could lead to price hikes, it probably costs more to produce electronic and mechanical with some consumers just migrating over . i cant really see why electronic should be more expensive in the long term, electronic chips are standard and cost pence in bult buy, small motors cant be that expensive either.the only thing specific needs to be the gearbox and packaging.

magliaceleste

One unscientific way you can easily tell a CULT bearing from a regular bearing is that there is no grease in a CULT bearing.

There are no real differences to 2012 vs 2011 groupsets apart from the Ti Spindle option and a dual pivot rear brake option (brake might have been available in 2011 version, I forget)

The actual weight saving of a Ti Spindle is 43 grams.

mfin

The brakes were the same Im pretty sure.

neeb

I'm 99% sure that there is absolutely no difference between the 2011 and 2012 top-end (chorus, record, SR) Campagnolo mechanical groupsets. There is effectively a 2009 range, a 2010 range and a 2011-12 range.