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would i be in my right to.........?

welshkevwelshkev Posts: 9,690
edited December 2009 in The Crudcatcher
i went for a short ride yesterday and on the way back i was riding through the car park of the local leisure centre and a dog went for me..luckily he was on a lead and the guy pulled him back but he was damn close!!! now i muttered something along the lines of "sh.it, bloody dog" and the guy starts to say i shouldn't be riding so close to him etc even though i was in a car park not on a footpath. i ignored him and kept on going.

now, what i want to know is: if the dog had bitten me, would i have been within my rights to kick the dog back and if the owner had got violent [email protected] him one aswell?

just a hyperthetical (spelling) situation but i was pondering it for the rest of my ride home :D

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  • IMO....................... YES!!! 8)
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  • Depends on the dog.
    If it was a fasion handbag dog I'd have no second thoughts about drop kicking the little fecker through some trees.... A rotweiller on the other hand...

    Anyways, it was a car park. Neither of you are cars so I'd say it was fair game.... Although I can't stand peoplethat can't keep control of their own dogs. Does my nut.
  • GraydawgGraydawg Posts: 673
    I wouldn't think twice at booting it in the chops if it bit me first!
    It's been a while...
  • El CapitanoEl Capitano Posts: 13,671
    IMO, it would be the dog owner's fault, they should be the ones getting the kicking, not the dog.
  • supersonicsupersonic Posts: 82,708 Lives Here
    Sounds like you may have startled it and it had a go.
  • xstrathyxxstrathyx Posts: 1,173
    yeah i am with you on that one El Capitano.

    Its the owners that should be held accountable. At the end of the day, dogs aren't the smartest creatures.


    IMO, it would be the dog owner's fault, they should be the ones getting the kicking, not the dog.
  • DufferDuffer Posts: 379
    You've always got a right to defend yourself - so you're quite within your rights to do all that's necessary to subdue the dog. Besides, the authorities wouldn't hesitate to have it put down for biting someone.
  • dunnnooodunnnooo Posts: 900
    You can always take action to defend yourself that is reasonable in the circumstances. If the dog had bit you you'd be within your rights to whack it one to get it off. You may not however break the dogs neck if it nips you, and then beat the living censored into an apologetic owner.
    I'd give my right hand to be ambi-dextrous
  • supersonicsupersonic Posts: 82,708 Lives Here
    Best thing to do is ride away.
  • D-Lock the cnut! [/commuter forum] :D

    Seriously though, if it had have bit you. Best advice would be to stop and call the Police. If it goes for you for no reason, it's a dangerous animal and needs to be put down.
    Sounds like a pansy thing to do, but rather that than have it go for some little kid.
    How guilty would you feel then?

    [email protected] the dog would just make it more angry towards cyclists in future,unless you killed it, in which case you'd probably end up facing cruelty charges. Same applies for [email protected] the owner too.
  • stomithstomith Posts: 332
    I think:

    Council Land/Car Park? You'd be in the censored . You are in control of 'a vehicle' and should make provisions for the pedestrians. Same as if you were in a car.

    Private car park? If so, it would be a censored for tat thing if it went to court which would just pi55 off a judge. e.g. Dog should be muzzled if it is likely to come into contact and react badly to cyclists. Therefore - owner could've done more. You could of adjusted you speed, approach and warning...and as such could've done more, also.

    Real life: Ignore it and let it go. You've got better things to do.

    Don't hit anyone. You definately don't need the grief from that.

    Personally. You are right. Dog should be put down. I don't like dogs. Kill the dog!
  • if you want to get savaged, kick the dog. it will have you. it's a dog.

    thing is, bike's are, to all intents and purposes, quiet, sometimed even silent. the only things that move quickly and silently in the wild are predators, so if you suprise an animal by 'rushing' up to it, it probably thinks you want to eat it/kill it, and it, pretty much, just defending itself.

    most dogs that lunge and bark aren't attacking, they're telling you they don't like what's happening, be it nervousness or whatever. if a dog is going to really go for you, it won't be making a noise.

    and ringing the police because you suprised a dog? get a life fella. it doesn't mean it's a dangerous dog. it has as much right to be some public place as you, so learn to live with, rather than think you have the right to control it. a bit daily mail outrage there i think mate, just because it lunges at something that's shocked it, and is far larger/taller than it, doesn't mean it's cujo the devil dog and it wants to eat your firstborn. ok if it bites you, but i mean savages, not nips.

    and 'the authorites' don't do that much about a dog biting a cyclist, especially as the owner WILL argue you startled it.

    if you have the time, and the owner is ok with it. stop, calmly, and get off your bike. stand with the owner and the dog while the dog works out that a bike and rider are no threat. (you can keep the bike between you and the dog if you like).

    dog's aren't blessed with the cognative thoughts we have, they go on instinct until told better, so if it bothers you, take the time to show the dog it has nothing to fear, it may take 1-15 minutes out of your life, but the owner and the dog, and any other cyclist that meets them, will be grateful.
  • supersonicsupersonic Posts: 82,708 Lives Here
    I've been nipped 5 times by different dogs (strangely all alsations though bar one!), one very recently where the dog was off the lead. I rounded a corner of the building at the same time it did and walked straight into it. Startled, it bit my hand. Owner was a moron, didn't say a word and it probably should be on a lead, but I think the outcome would have been the same - you frighten a dog, and they often react like this.

    When biking I always make sure that the owner of the dog knows I am there, and take a wide berth as not to frighten it. You cycle past at speed and 2 inch from it's nose, you will scare the censored out of it.
  • supersonicsupersonic Posts: 82,708 Lives Here
    Oh, the other was a Rhodesian Ridgeback. That was definitely brown troosers time.
  • welshkevwelshkev Posts: 9,690
    i appreciate that bikes are quiet that's why i gave them i'd say a 6-8ft berth, the dog started to growl and the owner looked up and it then launched itself towards me to the full extent of the lead - luckily it was a short lead lol.

    i did just ride on, i muttered to myself more than to the owner. not sure what type of dog it was, some sort of cross, but it was pretty big, not one of these hand bag pooches :lol:

    like i said, it was just a hyperthetical (spelling again) situation :D
  • supersonicsupersonic Posts: 82,708 Lives Here
    Maybe your bike smelled of bonios.
  • AnonymousAnonymous Posts: 28,799
    ive heard it said before and for the most part i agree: there's no such thing as a bad dog, it's bad owners.

    hounds are creatures of instinct, you can give them new instincts by teaching them but either way, dogs are very habitual, they dont show malice or evil, they just know what they have been taught.

    ive got a rottweiler and she is the softest dog in the world. she is very bright, very inquisitive (arent all pups!) and loves affection more than anything else in the world. im confident i wont have to do a great deal to make sure she stays lik this. we dont play pulling games with her, we over react if our hands end up in her mouth so she knows its not acceptable (this only ever happens by accident anyway) and we praise all of her good natured attributes.

    im certain you have to teach a rottweiler to be a horrible dog either through neglect or by deliberately trying to raise an agressive dog.

    as mentioned above, i hate to see bad dog owners as it is almost always the dog who pays the price in the end if something goes wrong. we just make sure our dogs dont end up in situations where they could upset other people.
  • VWsurfbumVWsurfbum Posts: 7,959
    Slightly off topic, I have a Weinerama and he's very stupid, but can be very protective especialy over my daughter, anyhoo i walked round to the shops with him and locked him to the post while i poped inside, he could see me and my daughter the whole time, this drunken fool tried to give hime a "cuddle" :shock: needless to say he wasnt too inpressed and barked very loudly and quite aggessivly at the fool, but the fool took it personally and came in and started shouting at me saying i should keep my dog under control!
    now i'm quite plassid around my daughter but when an idiot starts spouting off about keeping my dog under control (he was secured to a post and couldnt go anywhere!) i proper lost it! Why would you approach a large dog that you dont know and then try and cuddle it?
    Rant over :evil:
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  • and ringing the police because you suprised a dog? get a life fella. it doesn't mean it's a dangerous dog.

    Before trying to be a smartass, try reading my post properly. I'm fairly sure I said quite clearly if it had have bit you. then you should consider calling the police. Which is a statement I stand by and something you seem to agree with "ok if it bites you, but i mean savages, not nips."

    If a dog bit me, assuming I was not riding like a complete fucknut, and was leaving plenty of room so as to NOT scare the animal I think that is a perfectly reasonable thing to do, and certainly a much better idea than trying to kick said dog / owner.

    Good effort though :roll: .
  • I have a real peeve about dog owners, it isn't the stupidity thing, i tend to assume just about everyone is an utter idiot until it is indicated otherwise. It isn't even that much owners who cannot keep their dogs under control. It's a domesticated wild animal at the end of the day, complacency will get you eaten in the end.

    What really bugs me is that a dog owner is probably a dog lover and cannot ever understand the existence of someone who plain doesn't like dogs, and doesn't particularly like being barked at. Why is is so hard to comprehend that I don't particularly want to be greeted by some strange mutt? I'm a chemist, i get that some people really don't like chemistry, why can't some dog owners manage the same?

    I am right in thinking that dogs have to be under control in public areas and on public rights of way?
  • SnellySnelly Posts: 140
    Yes - dogs have to be under control at all times but that doesn't necessarily mean on a lead.

    Some very sensible advice here that clearly shows some posters have a genuine understanding of the way a dog thinks and what it means to a canine to have a bike ride by.

    That said, as an owner of three dogs, I find some of the comments on this thread hard to believe. For example, kick the dog, smack the owner, kill the dog etc. I can only assume that you are teenagers, yet to mature in to sensible adults.

    The same can't be said of the chemist above who thinks everyone is an idiot and is frightened of dogs. My advice to you would be to grow some balls and stop being scared of small mammals.
    Fortes fortuna adiuvat.
  • ramemtbersramemtbers Posts: 1,562
    i sort of kicked a dog once. i was doing my paper round and a lady opened the door and a hand bag dog viscously attacked my trousers and shoe. it got sent i tells yah (only a couple of feet, but it ran into the house like hot $h!t off a shovel.) she gave me a 20 quid tip this year. (probably because i didnt sue)
  • welshkevwelshkev Posts: 9,690
    Snelly wrote:
    Yes - dogs have to be under control at all times but that doesn't necessarily mean on a lead.

    Some very sensible advice here that clearly shows some posters have a genuine understanding of the way a dog thinks and what it means to a canine to have a bike ride by.

    That said, as an owner of three dogs, I find some of the comments on this thread hard to believe. For example, kick the dog, smack the owner, kill the dog etc. I can only assume that you are teenagers, yet to mature in to sensible adults.

    The same can't be said of the chemist above who thinks everyone is an idiot and is frightened of dogs. My advice to you would be to grow some balls and stop being scared of small mammals.

    did i once say that i was scared of it? i am a 32 y/o professional guy that was asking a hyperthetical question....like i said, i saw the dog and gave it a berth of about 6-8 feet..large enough i think... i like dogs, and i appreciate that not all dogs would snap at you when startled, or just cos they don't like bikes but don't assume that we're all immature teenagers, "assume makes and censored out of u and me" as i was once told :lol:
  • defflerdeffler Posts: 829
    if you want to get savaged, kick the dog. it will have you. it's a dog.

    thing is, bike's are, to all intents and purposes, quiet, sometimed even silent. the only things that move quickly and silently in the wild are predators, so if you suprise an animal by 'rushing' up to it, it probably thinks you want to eat it/kill it, and it, pretty much, just defending itself.

    most dogs that lunge and bark aren't attacking, they're telling you they don't like what's happening, be it nervousness or whatever. if a dog is going to really go for you, it won't be making a noise.

    and ringing the police because you suprised a dog? get a life fella. it doesn't mean it's a dangerous dog. it has as much right to be some public place as you, so learn to live with, rather than think you have the right to control it. a bit daily mail outrage there i think mate, just because it lunges at something that's shocked it, and is far larger/taller than it, doesn't mean it's cujo the devil dog and it wants to eat your firstborn. ok if it bites you, but i mean savages, not nips.

    and 'the authorites' don't do that much about a dog biting a cyclist, especially as the owner WILL argue you startled it.

    if you have the time, and the owner is ok with it. stop, calmly, and get off your bike. stand with the owner and the dog while the dog works out that a bike and rider are no threat. (you can keep the bike between you and the dog if you like).

    dog's aren't blessed with the cognative thoughts we have, they go on instinct until told better, so if it bothers you, take the time to show the dog it has nothing to fear, it may take 1-15 minutes out of your life, but the owner and the dog, and any other cyclist that meets them, will be grateful.

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  • missmarplemissmarple Posts: 1,980
    It isn't dogs around here, its irrate American pensioners who are utterly pathetic and should bluddy well grow up. Rant over.

    But I see what you mean about the whole dog thing....
  • Okay, as a rider and dog owner, here's a two penny worth...

    As a dog owner you are responsible. For everything. If someone comes up to my dog, and kicks it repeatedly until it bites him, then it is my fault. Thi is what the law is.

    As to whether you should have twatted the dog, I'd say no. It's obviously already scared of bikes as it doesn't sound as though you surprised it. So it's good the dog is on a lead, but poor that the owner is having a go at you. If I'm not confident that my dog will remain calm and under control, I don't take him into that situation. Best thing if you can is to keep calm, and speak to the owner if you feel the need. Our dog used to be worried by bikes, and we spent a few afternoons with freinds on bikes, getting him used to them, that they were just normal people with some other bits asa well, not some bizarre new animal/threat. Just the same as we do with the milk float and the postman. Dogs aren't clever, and it takes a while to learn. Hopefully the owner will try to make an effort.

    Then again, judging by the amount of dog censored around, an awful lot of dog owners are inconsiderate to$$ers. Sorry, I hate them too... :cry:
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  • supersonicsupersonic Posts: 82,708 Lives Here
    If someone kicked me repeatedly, I'd bloody well bite them hehe.
  • colintravcolintrav Posts: 1,074
    welshkev wrote:
    i went for a short ride yesterday and on the way back i was riding through the car park of the local leisure centre and a dog went for me..luckily he was on a lead and the guy pulled him back but he was damn close!!! now i muttered something along the lines of "sh.it, bloody dog" and the guy starts to say i shouldn't be riding so close to him etc even though i was in a car park not on a footpath. i ignored him and kept on going.

    now, what i want to know is: if the dog had bitten me, would i have been within my rights to kick the dog back and if the owner had got violent [email protected] him one aswell?

    just a hyperthetical (spelling) situation but i was pondering it for the rest of my ride home :D


    Some dogs act differently around bikes , cars .. and people .. It's all down to how they have been trained as a puppy .
    Yet some dogs see it as a territorial thing whereby they view you as a threat , invading there space so act upon it .. meanwhile some Dogs just don't like being round strangers period ..
    What kind of Dog was it that jumped at you ?

    Mine for example which am sure this is pretty common behaviour soons as anything is posted thro the letter box he attacks letter box and has virutally took it off the door lol
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