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Deep Section Wheels

zedderszedders Posts: 509
edited November 2009 in Road beginners
Deep section / Aero wheels!
As a beginner / novice (2 ½ yrs riding) am slowly looking to move forward and improve both my bike, my riding and fitness, and am looking into deep section (50mm+) / aero wheels. However TBH I’d say one of the reason I looking in them as because they look the absolute daddy! And a nice pair would look fantastic on my Ribble. Yes I’m a bit shallow. But am sure most would agree they want their bike to look good?

However I have TBH again and say other than looking great I know absolute censored all about deep section /aero wheels! I’ve had a look on the net, and on previous threads on this forum and haven’t really found anything that explains them to a dunce. Any chance I could open the floor up to you guys and get a few pointers?

I have my C2C bianchi set up for winter rides, so predominately they will be for dry weather/summer rides on my Ribble sportive. I’m 14st, and rides are varied from a 15 mile dash to work to a 50 miler (ave 100miles + p/w in the summer). How much faster are they compared to say Zondas or Aksiums that I already have? Are they as reliable? Are they only really for racing etc, What’s the difference between 50, 80mm etc apart from the obvious size, blah blah blah? Too many questions I know but I did say I know Jack. TBH I’d be looking to spend no more £750, which I know is not a lot compared to Zipp wheels for example. Anymore and the misses would shoot me.

Any comments you have on DS wheels or aero wheels would be most gratefully received, and if someone could be bothered to give me some basic facts/knowledge/experiences that would be great to.
Cheers
"I spend my petrol money on Bikes, Beer, Pizza, and Donuts "

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Posts

  • AnonymousAnonymous Posts: 79,692
    Mavic cosmic carbons are on the edge of your budget, would take your weight, but you may get lighter wheels that are not deep section for less money. They are used for aero/tt due to the fact the weight is not so much of an issue as the inertia and aerodynamic balance out the heavier weight. You would have to spend loads to get a light pair. If all round road riding is what you want, get a decent set of Mavic's or fulcrums for about £500, lighter, more robust and only slightly less aero. I have had Mavic Kysirium ssc sl wheels for 3 years and they have been the nuts.
  • InfamousInfamous Posts: 1,158
    Planet x have some for £400.

    Don't go deeper than 50mm, if they have a carbon brake surface, be careful on the descents. You will be marginally faster, but they do look loads better.
  • woody-somwoody-som Posts: 1,001
    i have a set of HED Jet 50's really love them. light but have stayed true for the loads of rough roads i've used them on.
  • markos1963markos1963 Posts: 3,724
    Have a look at these, well within budget and look the dogs, the 50mm rims aren't too heavy either. Saving up for a pair for next season myself.

    http://www.fuertebici.com/shop/wheels.html
  • Some things to think about:

    1. Anything deeper than 50mm will be a sod in cross winds

    2. Carbon rims need specific pads to brake with any confidence

    3. Carbon clinchers in the past have had problems with cracking on the top of the lip of the rim

    4. Because of point 3 Tubular section rims will be more reliable but you have the problem of fitting tubs (if you've never used them before). Although IMHO riding quality is much better with tubs. But I would only recommend them for racing - all round riding/training/sportives clinchers are easier to live with

    5. Bearing in mind all the above points for a wheel to cover all bases I would go for a aluminium rimmed 50mm deep clincher (but these will be heavier). So in this area you're looking at Mavic Cosmics, some HEDs and Dalkia's.
    Expertly coached by http://www.vitessecyclecoaching.co.uk/

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  • markos1963markos1963 Posts: 3,724
    Some things to think about:

    1. Anything deeper than 50mm will be a sod in cross winds

    2. Carbon rims need specific pads to brake with any confidence

    3. Carbon clinchers in the past have had problems with cracking on the top of the lip of the rim

    4. Because of point 3 Tubular section rims will be more reliable but you have the problem of fitting tubs (if you've never used them before). Although IMHO riding quality is much better with tubs. But I would only recommend them for racing - all round riding/training/sportives clinchers are easier to live with

    5. Bearing in mind all the above points for a wheel to cover all bases I would go for a aluminium rimmed 50mm deep clincher (but these will be heavier). So in this area you're looking at Mavic Cosmics, some HEDs and Dalkia's.

    Very good points above, thanks you've helped me make up my mind re. tubs or clinchers. Will be buying tubulars and also taking advantage of the lower weight of using tubs.
  • markos1963 wrote:
    Some things to think about:

    1. Anything deeper than 50mm will be a sod in cross winds

    2. Carbon rims need specific pads to brake with any confidence

    3. Carbon clinchers in the past have had problems with cracking on the top of the lip of the rim

    4. Because of point 3 Tubular section rims will be more reliable but you have the problem of fitting tubs (if you've never used them before). Although IMHO riding quality is much better with tubs. But I would only recommend them for racing - all round riding/training/sportives clinchers are easier to live with

    5. Bearing in mind all the above points for a wheel to cover all bases I would go for a aluminium rimmed 50mm deep clincher (but these will be heavier). So in this area you're looking at Mavic Cosmics, some HEDs and Dalkia's.

    Very good points above, thanks you've helped me make up my mind re. tubs or clinchers. Will be buying tubulars and also taking advantage of the lower weight of using tubs.

    In that case I can recommend some Gigantex 50mm Tubular wheels from this guy
    www.wheelsmith.co.uk

    I have a pair and they're superb for the money. (Built onto Novatec Lites with CX Rays as you'll see on the site they're bloody light!)

    He can build the rims (Gigantex are a massive Far East carbon specialist and build rims for a variety of different brands - Planet X rims are from Gigantex for instance) onto a big variety of hubs to suit budgets etc. He also uses different spokes to suit. An added bonus is that they also come with carbon specific pads. They're not as good as Swiss Stop for instance but will do a good job until you want to get some better ones.

    He can even supply different tubs and fit them for you if you like
    Expertly coached by http://www.vitessecyclecoaching.co.uk/

    http://vineristi.wordpress.com - the blog for Viner owners and lovers!
  • zedderszedders Posts: 509
    ummm? Cheers for the comments so far guys, all very interesting stuff. Keep it coming!

    If rimms larger than 50mm are a censored in the wind why would folk want them? And carbon rims cracking, again why would folk want them? I'm geting slightly worried now.

    I think for all round ease of use then clinchers would be the way forward for me. 50mm tops and poss alu rimms, you reckon? So would a set of wheels with these parametres be all round better than my zondas? & what would you class a light (under how many grams)?
    "I spend my petrol money on Bikes, Beer, Pizza, and Donuts "

    http://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected]/3517156549/
  • redddraggonredddraggon Posts: 10,862
    zedders wrote:
    If rimms larger than 50mm are a censored in the wind why would folk want them?

    It's not always windy. Deeper is more aero too.
    I like bikes...

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  • zedderszedders Posts: 509
    zedders wrote:
    If rimms larger than 50mm are a censored in the wind why would folk want them?

    It's not always windy. Deeper is more aero too.

    Fair comment. :oops: I was thinking about riding in sunny leices though! Lots of sunny days, but not many still days.
    "I spend my petrol money on Bikes, Beer, Pizza, and Donuts "

    http://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected]/3517156549/
  • markos1963markos1963 Posts: 3,724
    markos1963 wrote:
    Some things to think about:

    1. Anything deeper than 50mm will be a sod in cross winds

    2. Carbon rims need specific pads to brake with any confidence

    3. Carbon clinchers in the past have had problems with cracking on the top of the lip of the rim

    4. Because of point 3 Tubular section rims will be more reliable but you have the problem of fitting tubs (if you've never used them before). Although IMHO riding quality is much better with tubs. But I would only recommend them for racing - all round riding/training/sportives clinchers are easier to live with

    5. Bearing in mind all the above points for a wheel to cover all bases I would go for a aluminium rimmed 50mm deep clincher (but these will be heavier). So in this area you're looking at Mavic Cosmics, some HEDs and Dalkia's.

    Very good points above, thanks you've helped me make up my mind re. tubs or clinchers. Will be buying tubulars and also taking advantage of the lower weight of using tubs.

    In that case I can recommend some Gigantex 50mm Tubular wheels from this guy
    www.wheelsmith.co.uk

    I have a pair and they're superb for the money. (Built onto Novatec Lites with CX Rays as you'll see on the site they're bloody light!)

    He can build the rims (Gigantex are a massive Far East carbon specialist and build rims for a variety of different brands - Planet X rims are from Gigantex for instance) onto a big variety of hubs to suit budgets etc. He also uses different spokes to suit. An added bonus is that they also come with carbon specific pads. They're not as good as Swiss Stop for instance but will do a good job until you want to get some better ones.

    He can even supply different tubs and fit them for you if you like


    Thanks for the link, looks really good and fullfills my original thought of getting some handbuilts as well as aero rims for TT's. Prices seem very reasonable.
  • zedders wrote:
    ummm? Cheers for the comments so far guys, all very interesting stuff. Keep it coming!

    If rimms larger than 50mm are a censored in the wind why would folk want them? And carbon rims cracking, again why would folk want them? I'm geting slightly worried now.

    I think for all round ease of use then clinchers would be the way forward for me. 50mm tops and poss alu rimms, you reckon? So would a set of wheels with these parametres be all round better than my zondas? & what would you class a light (under how many grams)?

    My point about carbon clinchers being frail was from comments from other guys on other forums - their rims problems did come about from hitting pot holes though!

    TBH - Zondas are a great all round wheel, very strong and pretty light and aero.

    Have a look on the weightweenies forum (just google it) - there's a lot of guys on there with a lot of experience with different bits of kit, especially wheels. Thye should be able to give you some good advice too
    Expertly coached by http://www.vitessecyclecoaching.co.uk/

    http://vineristi.wordpress.com - the blog for Viner owners and lovers!
  • AnonymousAnonymous Posts: 79,692
    Careful descending for a long time on Carbon rims, blokes have been falling off due to tub adhesive melting and longer stooping times when braking. Saw this 3 times on the Nova colli and thet were all Brits. The pros and experienced make good usu of the all carbon, but I would go down the road of an aluminium braking surface. Just an opinion not the absolute. :wink:
  • APIIIAPIII Posts: 2,010
    Some other things to think about:
    Deeper rims often feel stiffer due to the shorter spoke lengths, so you may sacrifice some ride comfort.
    Most clinchers are a carbon fairing bonded onto an aluminium rim. They have the benefit of better braking, but the penalty of additional weight. It's not so much of a problem in TT's where you're maintaining a relatively constant speed, but they will feel less spritely when accelerating akin with normal riding). There are some reasonable priced full carbon clinchers. Actually, I can only think of Reynolds and their Strykes, and Assault wheels (both under a grand).
    Some things get spoken so often that they eventually end becoming an accepted truth. This is what has happened with tubs v clinchers. YOU can decide whether tubs are more hassle than clinchers. Personally, for the 1 or 2 punctures a year, I'm happy to trade that 'inconvenience' for the weight savings and ride quality.
  • oldwelshmanoldwelshman Posts: 4,733
    IMHO leave them alone.
    One one descent in Italy I went through both fornt and back brake pads!! Oh and they are rubbish under braking in wet compared to alloy rims.
    In the UK the roads are also bad so they feel bumpy!!
    I removed mine and only use them on the continent, very expensive that!! so I use dura ace clinchers with cabon laminate, best wheels I got but not the most expensive. at £550 a pair compaired to £1800 for the pinarello charisma/corima wheels.
  • kingrollokingrollo Posts: 3,148
    I consider myself a very vain cyclist - and have considered deep section wheels - however I have come to the conclusion that is is to much trouble/expense - which at my level of cycling I can't justify.
  • kingrollo wrote:
    I consider myself a very vain cyclist - and have considered deep section wheels - however I have come to the conclusion that is is to much trouble/expense - which at my level of cycling I can't justify.

    I must admit I only use my 50mm wheels for racing.

    Any other riding I use Zonda's, although I'm going to get a pair of lightweight 30mm Nibium rims built. The front Zonda had a few spokes ripped in a crit. Getting hold of replacement spokes and getting the wheel fixed made me realise that factory built wheels can be a pain when they go wrong.

    From now on I'll be sticking to handbuilts.
    Expertly coached by http://www.vitessecyclecoaching.co.uk/

    http://vineristi.wordpress.com - the blog for Viner owners and lovers!
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