Another waste of time panorama...

junglist_matty

This week panorama looks at rasism and anti-social behaviour...

http://news.bbc.co.uk/panorama/hi/front ... 303229.stm

Rant for the day...
Doesn't it annoy you that the racist card always gets the highest priority when trying to tackle these problem people?
These un-educated chav's are abusive to anyone, not just people of ethnic or black origin. If your typical white person be it someone who is a goth, a rocker, an idie kid, a skater boy (i.e. hoody / baggy jeans), an old person, a posh looking person etc... (anyone) they'd get abuse shouted at them relavant to what they looked like. Its not that they specifically target ethnic people because they don't they target anyone they don't know that they don't like the look of..... What annoys me is the racist card is such a touchy subject, but non-racial abuse (just as hurtfull abuse) never gets highlighted in comparison.

bails87

Hmmm, not sure I agree with that. They are likely to be scumbags towards lots of people, but racial abuse is particularly hurtful. Saying that, I don't know if being mugged really constitutes racist abuse, more likely to have happened because she was out on her own on a dodgy estate.

Being called a goth, when you've chosen to dress as a goth is nowhere near as bad as being called some of the race based abusive terms. But being attacked because you look/dress/speak/believe differently is always wrong.

I've only experienced any overt racism once (fortunately) apart from a couple of misguided/harmless things said by mates, that if they had have been said by a shop worker to a customer could have caused trouble, but I put it down to a lack of understanding.

The one occasion that got to me was when I was out at a pub with a group of mates, all white except for my asian housemate who was sat next to me. A guy behind us (about 50yrs old, no scummy chav teen) kept looking round at us, and at his bag which was on the floor behind him, between us and him. Eventually I caught his eye when he looked round and said "are you alright there mate?". And he calmly replied "oh, sorry, it's just that I was brought up not to trust people like you......nothing personal" chuckled to himself, picked up his bag and put it out of reach of us theiving migrants :roll: and carried on with his pint. I was absolutely speechless. It wasn't a particularly hatefilled thing to say, but what happens when I apply for a job, or need a doctor, or call the police, and the person I'm relying on has the same views as him. Makes you wonder!

On a similar note http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/8314125.stm
'Ms Szrodecki said: "This is a very common event - someone being beaten up should be a crime."'

Suely it is a crime! Doesn't matter if you're fat or not!

The Northern Monkey

People wanted to start a whites only club at uni but they weren't allowed.

However the afro-carribean club was a great sucess :roll:

bails87

But if a white person wanted to join the minority club then they probably could. How many white people believe in getting rid of racism, listen to reggae music and wish they could grow an afro!? Common ground see! :P

A whites only club is by definition exclusionary (is that a word?) and based on race. A club that exists to help the cause of a minority group in society which suffers from discrimination is a very different proposition to what would have turned into a National Front/BNP recuitment tool.

The majority doesn't need special groups to support their cause becasue they're the majority, so they are catered for(I'm speaking for myself here BTW, culturally I consider myself to be white and middle class, I just dont necessarily look like it ).

Oh, and I guess you have a problem with groups for disabled students too then Benj?

.blitz

bails87 wrote:

How many white people...wish they could grow an afro!?

Tried to grow dreads once but it's not a good look when you're going thin on top.

bails87

Dread combover! 8)

.blitz

Anonymous

I had dreads once. Saw Newton faulkner on telly recently, and someone in the room reminded me I used to look like him, if he'd been lifting weights for years!

.blitz

Jeez - ginger dreads :shock:

Anonymous

I've had many stupid hair ideas over the years. Arguably I still do.
I also used to pull my very long hair through the vents in my helmet, and spike it up. Very odd. Oh, and it was blue/green back then.

Mis-spent youth.

.blitz

It must be great to have some hair to do stupid things with

Where are my stabilisers?

Those little Fuc*tards really need some educating - totally unacceptable behaviour :roll:

As said above - people choose to dress like goth's etc, and no, they don't deserve abuse either, but racism is on another level.

If I'm walking down the street, I don't expect to be hit in the face because of my colour and my accent!

redvee

Having watched the program and being from Bristol, I can say that the actions of a few could have been any council estate in the country. The program has been edited to show the worst, if they included the good that there is in the community of Southmead the program would have lost some of the integrity. Some of the incidents shown weren't in Southmead. On the local paper's, Bristol Evening Post, website there have been 180+ comments on the program, mostly syaing the same as I have.

montevideoguy

The MOBOs.... biggest sack of racist balls currently going outside of the BNP.

You could smell the perma-rage by the nation's vocal band of professionally offended if they done a MOWO.


On another note... what about that this call to put "fatism" on the same par as racism?

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/8314125.stm

So a doctor won't be allowed to tell some fat tub they should slim down to avoid getting diabetes and heart problems...the world has gone mad and these people want to make sticking their heads in the sand a legal right....fucking idiots!

bails87

Coatbridgeguy wrote:

The MOBOs.... biggest sack of racist balls currently going outside of the BNP.

You could smell the perma-rage by the nation's vocal band of professionally offended if they done a MOWO.

But anyone can win an award, it's based on the style of music, not race! It was set up as an award for less mainstream music, admittedly now "Music (not musicians) Of Black Origin" is very popular. Something like the Kerrang awards is aimed at music that is typically of "white origin".

montevideoguy

The stigma that would be attached to something called the "music of white origin" would make such a concept impossible without mass hysteria. That's the problem I have...not with the awards themselves (I'm staying away from the asertions that several stars pulled out of going this year due to Glasgow being "too white")

bails87

Here is your MOWO awards!

Anonymous

haha, true. A friend of mine won folk musician of the year in 2008, I think.

bails87

yeehaamcgee wrote:

haha, true. A friend of mine won folk musician of the year in 2008, I think.

Cool, probably beats a Brit award!

Did he like to get offended at the idea of other people possibly being offended at a hypothetical proposition though?

montevideoguy

It's all about equality

My 3km swimming certificate is probably a biggrt thing than winning a brit though :P

Anonymous

bails87 wrote:

yeehaamcgee wrote:

haha, true. A friend of mine won folk musician of the year in 2008, I think.

Cool, probably beats a Brit award!

Did he like to get offended at the idea of other people possibly being offended at a hypothetical proposition though?

I'm struggling to make sense of the question, my flu-addled brain can't cope with it!

bails87

Coatbridgeguy wrote:

You could smell the perma-rage by the nation's vocal band of professionally offended if they done a MOWO.

He seemed to suggest a MOWO award, then suggest that people would take offence, then took offence at the prospect of people taking offence!


And CoatBridgeGuy, I agree about equality, but it's no different from having a Folk/Rock/Jazz/Classical music awards. It's just a genre of music, again, not based on the race of the performer. It just seems that what you'd like is music awards for white people, not for music of white origin (which is basically what the Brit Awards are, just mainstream music to cater for the white masses).

It's like suggesting a set of film awards specifically for films made in Hollywood because they're under represented in the mainstream awards (Oscars etc). There's no need, but if you make the same argument for Bollywood/Independent/Documentary films then it becomes a valid argument.

Daz555

Arguments about MOBOS and other black associations are not really relevant in relation to the Panorama documentary.

What matters is the utter f*cking sh*ts that feature in the program. Sh*ts like that are found across all races in all parts of the country. Sh*ts who will go on to breed more sh*ts with equally abhorrent views.

Blimey - that kid with the brick - I don't think I've ever wanted to punch anyone more in my life!

THEY are the problem, not the MOBOS, or the MOWOS or any other such trivial matters.

adb1006

bails87 wrote:

Here is your MOWO awards!

Except a lot of folk is "stolen" from the old (predominantly) black blues grass musicians

How much would i have laughed if Amil had just sparked that chav piece of sh1t out cold when he hit him in the side of the head! No that would surely have been award-winning TV!!!

montevideoguy

bails87 wrote:

Coatbridgeguy wrote:

You could smell the perma-rage by the nation's vocal band of professionally offended if they done a MOWO.

He seemed to suggest a MOWO award, then suggest that people would take offence, then took offence at the prospect of people taking offence!


And CoatBridgeGuy, I agree about equality, but it's no different from having a Folk/Rock/Jazz/Classical music awards. It's just a genre of music, again, not based on the race of the performer. It just seems that what you'd like is music awards for white people, not for music of white origin (which is basically what the Brit Awards are, just mainstream music to cater for the white masses).

It's like suggesting a set of film awards specifically for films made in Hollywood because they're under represented in the mainstream awards (Oscars etc). There's no need, but if you make the same argument for Bollywood/Independent/Documentary films then it becomes a valid argument.

I'm not taking offence at the hypothetical possibility of people taking offence at a hypothetical award (that're more a point that we live in a society where alot of people exist purely to be outraged)......too many hypotheticals but we all know the readers of the Daily Mail exist!!

I still think that as an awards it is biased to the point of racism by default of it's name and something similar geared towards white people would be denounced. It doesn't bother me that the awards exist. I just believe that by naming it they have created a situation where there is division and in this day and age we should be trying to bin that.

Now if we're talking about things I think are unfair I'd rather moan about Loose Women and the fact if you had the same programme but with guys bitching about women for most of it it would last about 20 mins before the feminist element burned down the studios

cee

Yeah....

and why are all the best cartoons on the Childrens channels????

adults like cartoons too you know

KonaKurt

I thought this weeks Panorama (getting back to the subject at hand!) was an excellent programme. Yes, it is true to say that young scumbags like the ones highlighted (who deserve to be caught and hung from a tree by their scrotum) will verbally abuse, threaten and even physically assult virtually ANYONE that they disapprove of. Such people have a serious problem and need to sort themselves out before a county court does!

But with that said, racism IS a very SERIOUS problem and IS very wrong. I think alot of people misunderstand the whole point of racism though and short circuit in the process. Racism is prejudice against a persons nationallity and ethnic origin, and ONLY against that. I think the reason why some people understandably claim that the racism card is overplayed, is simply because it is sometimes used as a weapon, as an alabi for causing trouble. Or as some kind of exception from the rules and civil laws of the land to others. Like many I am sure, I have witnessed this first hand on numerous occassions in our troubled society. The people being abused in the Panorama programme were perfectly nice people trying to make their way in life, and just wanted to be left alone. All 'good' people are all equal in this world in terms of human rights and deserving dignity, regardless of their appearence. I personally am half mediterainian (think pitta bread!) although I am English born and bred, and to hear my voice or to look at me, you would never guess I was less than 100% English! My point is that you cannot judge a book by it's cover, and people who 'object' to other people's covers need to deal with their insecurity and behave more responsibly without exception. I have nothing to say about illegal immigrants to Britain of course, as they have no right to be in this country at all. But anyone born here, and a peaceful good citizen has every RIGHT to be able to walk down ANY street they like at any time, withour fear of beig attacked or abused by others who are too weak willed to give them the respect they deserve. I used to work in a company where large proportions of the workforce originated from outside of the UK. Jamaica, India, Pakistan, Russia, Brazil, Spain, China, Korea, Kenya.. the list goes on, and the majority of these people were very nice to know and hardworking legal British citizens who were a credit to know.

It sounds like an obvious question, but it works - how would any English person like to be treated in a foreign country that is not their own?

Sorry for the long post here, but to sum up - racism IS a serious issue, though at times a misconcieved one, as no legally obiding peaceful person deserves to be a direct vicim of fear, crime or physically hit because they do not appear to be 'English'. I hope the Bristol thugs featured on the show all get strung up with no compassionate release. No thug ever deserves any compassion.

However, of course there ARE some people in this world trying hard to take advantage of British hospitality and our quality of life illegally, or worse, are actually racist against the British and others themselves..

KK and his pitta bread.

montevideoguy

KonaKurt wrote:

I thought this weeks Panorama (getting back to the subject at hand!) was an excellent programme. Yes, it is true to say that young scumbags like the ones highlighted (who deserve to be caught and hung from a tree by their scrotum) will verbally abuse, threaten and even physically assult virtually ANYONE that they disapprove of. Such people have a serious problem and need to sort themselves out before a county court does!

But with that said, racism IS a very SERIOUS problem and IS very wrong. I think alot of people misunderstand the whole point of racism though and short circuit in the process. Racism is prejudice against a persons nationallity and ethnic origin, and ONLY against that. I think the reason why some people understandably claim that the racism card is overplayed, is simply because it is sometimes used as a weapon, as an alabi for causing trouble. Or as some kind of exception from the rules and civil laws of the land to others. Like many I am sure, I have witnessed this first hand on numerous occassions in our troubled society. The people being abused in the Panorama programme were perfectly nice people trying to make their way in life, and just wanted to be left alone. All 'good' people are all equal in this world in terms of human rights and deserving dignity, regardless of their appearence. I personally am half mediterainian (think pitta bread!) although I am English born and bred, and to hear my voice or to look at me, you would never guess I was less than 100% English! My point is that you cannot judge a book by it's cover, and people who 'object' to other people's covers need to deal with their insecurity and behave more responsibly without exception. I have nothing to say about illegal immigrants to Britain of course, as they have no right to be in this country at all. But anyone born here, and a peaceful good citizen has every RIGHT to be able to walk down ANY street they like at any time, withour fear of beig attacked or abused by others who are too weak willed to give them the respect they deserve. I used to work in a company where large proportions of the workforce originated from outside of the UK. Jamaica, India, Pakistan, Russia, Brazil, Spain, China, Korea, Kenya.. the list goes on, and the majority of these people were very nice to know and hardworking legal British citizens who were a credit to know.

It sounds like an obvious question, but it works - how would any English person like to be treated in a foreign country that is not their own?

Sorry for the long post here, but to sum up - racism IS a serious issue, though at times a misconcieved one, as no legally obiding peaceful person deserves to be a direct vicim of fear, crime or physically hit because they do not appear to be 'English'. I hope the Bristol thugs featured on the show all get strung up with no compassionate release. No thug ever deserves any compassion.

However, of course there ARE some people in this world trying hard to take advantage of British hospitality and our quality of life illegally, or worse, are actually racist against the British and others themselves..

KK and his pitta bread.

Agree on everything there.Well said

guilliano

I did start watching it, but got fed up of yet another "true look at Britain's racist problem" type programme. I have seen numerous documentaries of this type (anyone remember Channel 4's Dispatches titled "It shouldn't happen to a Muslim"?).

I have to give Channel 4 some credit..... they at least show the reverse side in other Dispatches programmes. The BBC however seems to ignore the fact that just as high a percentage of black and Asian people are racist and portray racism as an exclusively white majority failing. It's not, it is an abhorrant trait of a small number of people of all races and until that is recognised and tackled racism will continue to be a problem no matter what you look like or where you come from.

bails87

Wise words KK and Guilliano. CoatBridgeGuy, hope I didnt cause any offence btw, might have come across a little hostile. I do agree that some people aim to be offended though, just look at the whole Ross/Brand shenanigans. People complained even though they hadn't heard it, if they were offended then surely that's the fault of the paper that printed it.

Cee: Fairly Odd Parents is brilliant, but now I have to go to work like a shmoe I don't get to watch it

welshkev

KonaKurt wrote:

It sounds like an obvious question, but it works - how would any English person like to be treated in a foreign country that is not their own?

.

did you specifically mean english person or british person? that's a bit racist towards us welsh, scots and irish ain't it?