Beginner TdF question - go easy on me

Jamey
Jamey Posts: 2,152
edited July 2009 in Road beginners
Ok so this is the first year I've paid any proper attention to the Tour de France.

I can sort of understand why a breakaway on a flat stage stands little chance of staying out in front but when you've got a gap of 12 minutes or more (like today) and people are still saying the gap will close very quickly towards the end... I don't get it... Why? Twelve minutes is a huge amount to be out in front by, surely they (the front runners) would have to slow to a crawl for the pack to catch them up?

Comments

  • Anonymous
    Anonymous Posts: 79,665
    Yes.

    They will!!
  • Why?
    because of a gert big hill!
  • Jamey
    Jamey Posts: 2,152
    If the breakaway guys managed to maintain the gap up the first big hill then why can't they do the same up the second one?
  • Anonymous
    Anonymous Posts: 79,665
    Tired.
  • a)they're more tired
    b)the big guns usually wait till the last climb to make their move. Conserve energy, don't let the escape get too far ahead but no need to close it down just yet.
    c)they tend not to be the best climbers in the first place. Once the good climbers start going for it, the escapees will get eaten up
  • CiB
    CiB Posts: 6,098
    The main bunch can share the load, allowing riders to conserve energy by not being in front all the while. A small breakaway has fewer riders to split the effort.

    If the whole peleton works together they'll easily catch a breakaway. This doesn't always happen.
  • Bhima
    Bhima Posts: 2,145
    In a breakaway of, say, 10 guys - if you are all drafting each other to save energy, you have to take a turn on the front 4 times more often than if there are 40 guys chasing you down, for example. So you'll get tired, quicker.

    The peloton usually let the breakaway get away at first, which is why the gap increases. The time gap can then look relatively stable for ages, even if the breakaway is slowing down. They let them get away to

    a) tire them out as much as possible
    b) plan the re-capture at the right time in order to discourage a 2nd breakaway going in the closing kms.

    When there's a hill, most of the climbing specialists would have done none of the work at the front for the flat bits, so they can attack on the hills, where they specialise. If there's a hill-climber in the breakaway, they would probably be too tired to attack the hill because they've already attacked to get in the break.
  • Jamey
    Jamey Posts: 2,152
    So finishes like today don't happen often then, with the head of the peloton finishing over three minutes behind the head of the breakaway?
  • El Imbatido
    El Imbatido Posts: 144
    On mountainous stages, The best climbers (Contador, Schleck, Evans Etc) usually time it so the breakawy gets eaten up on the last climb and the best climber takes the win. (In the other grand tours, you get bonus seconds taken off your time if you come in the first three places) Today though, it could have been that Astana knew Cancellara would lose his yellow jersey but didnt want to take it so therefor let one of the guys in the break take the yellow jersey. It is the duty of the yellow jersey team to do the work on the front (usually).
    Do you have any Therapeutic Use Exemptions?
    No. Never have.
    Never? What about the cortisone?
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  • mitchgixer6
    mitchgixer6 Posts: 729
    On mountainous stages, The best climbers (Contador, Schleck, Evans Etc) usually time it so the breakawy gets eaten up on the last climb and the best climber takes the win. (In the other grand tours, you get bonus seconds taken off your time if you come in the first three places) Today though, it could have been that Astana knew Cancellara would lose his yellow jersey but didnt want to take it so therefor let one of the guys in the break take the yellow jersey. It is the duty of the yellow jersey team to do the work on the front (usually).

    So if the Yellow jersey team are responsible for doing most of the work, how come Astana are virtually always on the front (the last few stages anyway)?

    Also, why come if there is a rider from the yellow jersey team in a breakaway, they get away with doing less work for the breakaway?
  • pjh
    pjh Posts: 204
    :D There's only so much fuel in the tank so to speak. Did you see the way Millar got caught a couple of days ago in the closing 300 yds.

    At interview afterward he said he'd simply run out of steam (i.e. run out of fuel :D )

    Riding in the peloton uses up to 30% less energy than riding in a small breakaway group or solo!

    Sometimes the breakaway will stay ahead as it did 3 days ago, but usually only when it's flat and there isn't any wind!

    It completely fascinating to watch :D


    It's great to be .....
  • daviesee
    daviesee Posts: 6,386
    On mountainous stages, The best climbers (Contador, Schleck, Evans Etc) usually time it so the breakawy gets eaten up on the last climb and the best climber takes the win. (In the other grand tours, you get bonus seconds taken off your time if you come in the first three places) Today though, it could have been that Astana knew Cancellara would lose his yellow jersey but didnt want to take it so therefor let one of the guys in the break take the yellow jersey. It is the duty of the yellow jersey team to do the work on the front (usually).

    So if the Yellow jersey team are responsible for doing most of the work, how come Astana are virtually always on the front (the last few stages anyway)?

    Also, why come if there is a rider from the yellow jersey team in a breakaway, they get away with doing less work for the breakaway?

    Although Astana do not have the yellow jersey they do have some of the front runners which is why they stay at the front.
    None of the above should be taken seriously, and certainly not personally.
  • oscarbudgie
    oscarbudgie Posts: 850
    Its worth pointing out that it depends on who is in the breakaway as to whether it gets brought back - if those in the breakaway are not GC contenders the team(s) setting the pace in the peloton will often be less inclined to use a lot of energy chasing them down. And of course the teams with men in the breakaway are less likely to ride hard - unless the man they have in the break is there to control it because they have a team mate who in the Peloton who is a GC contender
    A great example was on Saturday when Cadel Evans (obviously still seen as a contender) tried to join up with the break but got sent off with a flea in his ear by the other riders (none in GC contention) who knew that having Evans with them would force the peloton to chase hard, meaning none of them would get a stage win.
    Its amazingly complex, and even politics is involved - (in)famously Lance Armstrong rode up to a 6 man break in 2004 because it contained Simeoni - not a GC man but a man 'guilty' of spilling the beans about doping ('spitting in the soup') and told the group that they would be allowed to continue their break only if they ejected Simeoni from it....and they did.
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