I sympathise with those refinery workers (bloggy)
downfader
Posts: 3,686
..because my job has landed in the same situation today. It seems I have to take an inteview for my own job. Everyone is now telling me they're applying for my job as I "have it easy" :shock: Yeah right!
I scrub 2000 customer plates, cups, and cutlery on me own. Then I keep cleaning, and chemical storage in check. My job keeps me fit and makes me sweat, and everytime another member of staff comes in they complain its too hot.
Looks like I'll be finding out if my job will remain the same tomorrow. They're trying to force a number of us up in to the wards to deal with patients (as its a hospital job) and its not something I want to do. Infact the though horrifies me.
All this is because our Trust didnt want to deal with redundencies and costly repairs and so got another company to take over the tender. I am so sure of this. A number of older staff are taking early retirement now, if only I had that option. :? Cant retire at 32
I scrub 2000 customer plates, cups, and cutlery on me own. Then I keep cleaning, and chemical storage in check. My job keeps me fit and makes me sweat, and everytime another member of staff comes in they complain its too hot.
Looks like I'll be finding out if my job will remain the same tomorrow. They're trying to force a number of us up in to the wards to deal with patients (as its a hospital job) and its not something I want to do. Infact the though horrifies me.
All this is because our Trust didnt want to deal with redundencies and costly repairs and so got another company to take over the tender. I am so sure of this. A number of older staff are taking early retirement now, if only I had that option. :? Cant retire at 32
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I would suggest that you don't apply for your own job (difference with the strikers was they were dismissed). If you have been working more than 12 months you are "employment protected". Your employers can't simply change your employment contract. In addition, if your employment is transferred to another employer, the TUPE rules (Transfer of Undertakings) apply, where the new employers have to honour your existing terms and conditions. Your employers cannot selectively make people redundant because they won't apply for their jobs or take on a different job. Don't apply for your job, apply for union membership, and don't get pushed around!
A while back my employers told 5 senior managers to apply for 3 jobs (i.e. they were getting rid of 2 jobs). The fools did apply, apart from one manager who refused to apply, she got one of the three jobs - there is a message there!0 -
alfablue wrote:I would suggest that you don't apply for your own job (difference with the strikers was they were dismissed). If you have been working more than 12 months you are "employment protected". Your employers can't simply change your employment contract. In addition, if your employment is transferred to another employer, the TUPE rules (Transfer of Undertakings) apply, where the new employers have to honour your existing terms and conditions. Your employers cannot selectively make people redundant because they won't apply for their jobs or take on a different job. Don't apply for your job, apply for union membership, and don't get pushed around!
A while back my employers told 5 senior managers to apply for 3 jobs (i.e. they were getting rid of 2 jobs). The fools did apply, apart from one manager who refused to apply, she got one of the three jobs - there is a message there!
If the law protects jobs like you say then how do NHS trusts get away with this every year. Chorley hospital used it to reduce the number of nurses they employ, so where is it written in law and why don't Trade Unions fight it?
Downfader, I know this has been hanging over you for a while and hope everything turns out okay in the end.
Red Rock0 -
Red Rock wrote:alfablue wrote:I would suggest that you don't apply for your own job (difference with the strikers was they were dismissed). If you have been working more than 12 months you are "employment protected". Your employers can't simply change your employment contract. In addition, if your employment is transferred to another employer, the TUPE rules (Transfer of Undertakings) apply, where the new employers have to honour your existing terms and conditions. Your employers cannot selectively make people redundant because they won't apply for their jobs or take on a different job. Don't apply for your job, apply for union membership, and don't get pushed around!
A while back my employers told 5 senior managers to apply for 3 jobs (i.e. they were getting rid of 2 jobs). The fools did apply, apart from one manager who refused to apply, she got one of the three jobs - there is a message there!
If the law protects jobs like you say then how do NHS trusts get away with this every year. Chorley hospital used it to reduce the number of nurses they employ, so where is it written in law and why don't Trade Unions fight it?
Downfader, I know this has been hanging over you for a while and hope everything turns out okay in the end.
Red Rock
They get away with it by eliminating the job. They do this by changing the job description and terms and conditions enough to make it techinically a new job, then they make everyone on the old job description and terms and conditions apply for the 'new' job which they can do because they are technically getting rid of the old job altogether i.e. making everyone redundant. They did this to my wife's department quite recently so they all had to reapply for their own jobs and after 3 months of CVs, covering letters and interviews she ended up doing exactly the same job as before but it had a different job title and description, but was miraculously on the same terms and conditions as before. A couple of people did leave and the general feeling was that the company wanted rid of these people but it's not allowed to just fire them or selectively make them redundant, so they go through the whole charade of making everyone apply for the 'new' job and then they just don't 'employ' the people they want rid of.'Hello to Jason Isaacs'0 -
They can make redundancies if they can show that the posts are actually dissappearing (I understand the refinery strikers were objecting that there were redundancies going on whilst another contracter was recruiting to the same jobs - hence the posts were not really redundant). Whilst one might argue that more nurses are needed, not less, the employer can decide to reduce numbers of nurses, short sighted as this may be.
If they need to make redundancies they should first seek voluntary redundancies, and only go compulsory if there are not enough volunteers. They also have to try and find suitable alternative posts before making people redundant.
What they can't do is enforce changes of job on people, or pick out some workers for redundancy because they don't cooperate. Forcing changes to contracts could be viewed as constructive dismissal which could be an unfair dismissal under the law.
The short answer as to why they get away with it is because trade unions are weak. For the reasons why they are weak, look to employee apathy and recent history. Are you in a union? Are you active? If not, then you can't really expect "the unions" to wave a magic wand, when they may have comparatively little support amongst the workforce.
Sound to me that your employers are trying to skirt around legal problems by getting workers to agree to re-apply, and given that most employees feel they are helpless to do anything, they will probably do what they are told, sewing the seeds of their own demise.0 -
As per what Schlep said, they are probably doing this, but they are trying to avoid actual redundancy compensation. If workers refused to cooperate their plan wouldn't work.0
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Cheers for the replies!
TBH I've been wanting to change my job for years now, but nothing suitable has come up. Its all employers demanding a pound in flesh around here and manky jobs. I have very few qualifications to fall back on and hate the idea of getting any more. I dont like the idea of not having a job and not being able to provide myway though you see.
Oh well, roll on tomorrow and lets see what happens. It seems all Trusts are doing this, and right across all departments. :? Welcome to your new NHS!0 -
Good luck Downfader!0
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I told you that Compass are wnakers0
