modern bike maintenance

General bike chat that does not fit elsewhere
kingrollo
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modern bike maintenance

Postby kingrollo » Mon Sep 09, 2019 08:19 am

Have a bit of a dispute with the retailer and supplier of my carbon bike.

It regularly creaks (loudly) supplier reckons this is down to routine maintenance. Ive been cycling for 30 years and whilst not not the greatest mechinic - I do most stuff myself - replace chain \ cassette regular lubing of chain - keeping the bike generally clean.

Each time the bike goes back I am told it is something simple, saddle, loose through axles, grease contact points - the creaking then goes for a few weeks - but then returns - I try what shop has told me without effect. It has a press fit BB which has been replaced and tightened

My own belief is there is something fundamentally wrong with the frame - supplier says I need to educate myself with modern bike maintenance - find the cause of the creak, grease it - do this as often as needed.

So is modern bike maintenance the cure here - or is my hunch about the frame correct - in your opinion of course !!!

Imposter
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Re: modern bike maintenance

Postby Imposter » Mon Sep 09, 2019 08:21 am

You haven't said what bike/frame - but if you feel your frame is defective and the shop says it isn't, then it's probably up to you to be more specific about which part or area of the frame is defective and why..

kingrollo
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Re: modern bike maintenance

Postby kingrollo » Mon Sep 09, 2019 08:39 am

Imposter wrote:You haven't said what bike/frame - but if you feel your frame is defective and the shop says it isn't, then it's probably up to you to be more specific about which part or area of the frame is defective and why..


I don't want to yet name the brand as this may end up in the small claims court.

My suspicion is the BB fitting area is slightly of and this works lose - giving me the creak (shop deny this) - also as my best bike it only gets used at weekends - due to il health this is probably around 50 miles per week tops - if everything is working lose to this mileage is this correct ? - or is something fundamentally wrong.

I took it to what I thought was an independent bike shop. Who greased and tightened everything - and said 'if that creaks now its a frame problem' - Supplier then phoned shop - and when I spoke to shop again he denied having said this.

Wayne Plunger
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Re: modern bike maintenance

Postby Wayne Plunger » Mon Sep 09, 2019 08:50 am

To be honest kingrollo my carbon bike has had a creak front the front end since day one, have just learned to live with it. It is circa 5 years old now and has done many miles with no detrimental affect.

As I am happy with it and not planning small claims it is an Orbea.

Imposter
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Re: modern bike maintenance

Postby Imposter » Mon Sep 09, 2019 08:51 am

kingrollo wrote:I don't want to yet name the brand as this may end up in the small claims court.


Not sure I get that. Naming the brand is unlikely to have any effect whatsoever on a claim. Knowing the brand name will, however, probably encourage more people with the same brand to offer their experiences, which may or may not be useful to your case in such a claim..

kingrollo
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Re: modern bike maintenance

Postby kingrollo » Mon Sep 09, 2019 08:55 am

Imposter wrote:
kingrollo wrote:I don't want to yet name the brand as this may end up in the small claims court.


Not sure I get that. Naming the brand is unlikely to have any effect whatsoever on a claim. Knowing the brand name will, however, probably encourage more people with the same brand to offer their experiences, which may or may not be useful to your case in such a claim..


ok - on your head be it

Kuota Khydra DI2

Imposter
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Re: modern bike maintenance

Postby Imposter » Mon Sep 09, 2019 08:57 am

kingrollo wrote:ok - on your head be it


what?

kingrollo
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Re: modern bike maintenance

Postby kingrollo » Mon Sep 09, 2019 08:58 am

Wayne Plunger wrote:To be honest kingrollo my carbon bike has had a creak front the front end since day one, have just learned to live with it. It is circa 5 years old now and has done many miles with no detrimental affect.

As I am happy with it and not planning small claims it is an Orbea.


Perhaps my creak is louder !!!

kingrollo
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Re: modern bike maintenance

Postby kingrollo » Mon Sep 09, 2019 08:59 am

Imposter wrote:
kingrollo wrote:ok - on your head be it


what?


Humour

Imposter
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Re: modern bike maintenance

Postby Imposter » Mon Sep 09, 2019 09:01 am

kingrollo wrote:
Imposter wrote:
kingrollo wrote:ok - on your head be it


what?


Humour


Right. Anyway, if you're going to build a case for small claims, then the first thing I'd do is get a third party inspection organised, preferably with a shop which has a reputation/understanding of press fit..

redvision
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Re: modern bike maintenance

Postby redvision » Mon Sep 09, 2019 09:06 am

Take it this is the same bike you asked for advice on earlier this summer?
viewtopic.php?f=40013&t=13106140&hilit=Kuota

Tbh if more than one shop can't solve the creak then i would have thought it may be a defect but surely the mechanics would have spotted this. The fact they haven't would suggest the chances of success in the small claims court is not good.

I would bite the bullet and just install a praxis works bb or similar, although I realise they don't always result in creak free riding.

This was announced at eurobike
https://www.bikeradar.com/news/cane-cre ... m-bracket/

keef66
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Re: modern bike maintenance

Postby keef66 » Mon Sep 09, 2019 09:09 am

My carbon bike with press-fit BB is utterly silent. I wouldn't be happy if it creaked.

On the other hand I live on a hill that's popular with local cyclists, and I'd say about one in five of the carbon bikes I see going up are emitting some kind of creak. Some are making such a racket I cannot believe they are structurally sound.

You shouldn't have to regularly strip your bike down and grease everything just to keep it quiet. I suspect something is not quite right. However with a carbon frame, identifying the cause of a creak can be notoriously difficult.

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Veronese68
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Re: modern bike maintenance

Postby Veronese68 » Mon Sep 09, 2019 12:54 pm

kingrollo wrote:Each time the bike goes back I am told it is something simple, saddle, loose through axles, grease contact points - the creaking then goes for a few weeks - but then returns - I try what shop has told me without effect. It has a press fit BB which has been replaced and tightened

So do you think they are tightening the bottom bracket every time and not telling you? If that is the case I'd say something is amiss, proving that is the case would have to be your next step.
If fixing something different is genuinely fixing it every time I'd say it's not the frame at fault.

keef66
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Re: modern bike maintenance

Postby keef66 » Mon Sep 09, 2019 14:07 pm

Is it the same creak every time? If it was thru axles / BB / saddle rails, they'd all make subtly different noises at different times. Saddle rails for instance wouldn't creak if you were pedalling out of the saddle.

I still think the BB is the likely culprit given your original description of the first BB virtually falling out when disassembled. And in which case it's more likely the BB shell has been manufactured slightly oversize, than the pressfit BB was too small.

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Alejandrosdog
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Re: modern bike maintenance

Postby Alejandrosdog » Mon Sep 09, 2019 15:59 pm

Should be silent if everything is set up properly and youre not a monster.

Where do you live? If local I’ll check your BB and headset and see if there’s anything obvious.

kingrollo
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Re: modern bike maintenance

Postby kingrollo » Tue Sep 17, 2019 18:00 pm

keef66 wrote:Is it the same creak every time? If it was thru axles / BB / saddle rails, they'd all make subtly different noises at different times. Saddle rails for instance wouldn't creak if you were pedalling out of the saddle.

I still think the BB is the likely culprit given your original description of the first BB virtually falling out when disassembled. And in which case it's more likely the BB shell has been manufactured slightly oversize, than the pressfit BB was too small.



Yes it always the same creak - have a listen here - Mind you some people like the noise some free hubs like - so maybe this is kouta 'sound' and I am just old fashioned - so for £3.5k you can have a bike that sounds like this !!!! (any ideas what it is ??)

https://drive.google.com/open?id=1kFL29 ... 9o3ctHVv8E

lesfirth
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Re: modern bike maintenance

Postby lesfirth » Tue Sep 17, 2019 18:35 pm

kingrollo wrote:
keef66 wrote:Is it the same creak every time? If it was thru axles / BB / saddle rails, they'd all make subtly different noises at different times. Saddle rails for instance wouldn't creak if you were pedalling out of the saddle.

I still think the BB is the likely culprit given your original description of the first BB virtually falling out when disassembled. And in which case it's more likely the BB shell has been manufactured slightly oversize, than the pressfit BB was too small.



Yes it always the same creak - have a listen here - Mind you some people like the noise some free hubs like - so maybe this is kouta 'sound' and I am just old fashioned - so for £3.5k you can have a bike that sounds like this !!!! (any ideas what it is ??)

https://drive.google.com/open?id=1kFL29 ... 9o3ctHVv8E


Bl00dy hell, Kingrollo , that is more than a creek! No one with half an ounce of mechanical sympathy could stand that.
IMHO creeks in bottom brackets are caused by something moving that should not. Pulling them to pieces and greasing everything makes it easier for the bit that is moving to move so it moves more easily and no longer creeks. This is fixing the symptom and not the cause and the noise is soon back. The problem might be fixed by bonding/glueing together the bits that are moving that should not, but on a new bike I would not stand for that.
That bike is not fit for purpose. Any so called bike mechanic who says that's OK is incompetent.

Pilot Pete
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Re: modern bike maintenance

Postby Pilot Pete » Tue Sep 17, 2019 20:08 pm

Is it in every gear combo, or only when going uphill in low gears? I ask because I’ve just found my creak was not BB but rear cassette! It was only in the lower gears (which are all riveted together on a carrier) when really pushing going uphill. It was a similar sound but nowhere near as loud as yours. Tightened to spec but this was allowing movement, tightened a bit tighter and problem sorted.

PP

kingrollo
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Re: modern bike maintenance

Postby kingrollo » Tue Sep 17, 2019 20:32 pm

Pilot Pete wrote:Is it in every gear combo, or only when going uphill in low gears? I ask because I’ve just found my creak was not BB but rear cassette! It was only in the lower gears (which are all riveted together on a carrier) when really pushing going uphill. It was a similar sound but nowhere near as loud as yours. Tightened to spec but this was allowing movement, tightened a bit tighter and problem sorted.

PP


Its only when going up steep hills - typically I am in the lower gears when going uphill !!!! - - How do I tighten the rear cassette - or should I purchase a new cassette ?

its been back to kuota - who inspected\removed the bb but found no problems with it - bikes comes back no creaking for a few weeks - then it returns.
took it to lbs - who removed bb and re seated it with some bonding agents - also said they thought the problem was a loose rear through axle - fine for 1st ride - but now creaking again - through axle seems tight enough

in total 3 different people have looked over the bike (shop purchased from, kuota, lbs) all have inspected the BB - on two occasions the bike has come back temporarily cured (once it came back worse - but shop were adamant it wasn't creaking on test ride)

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darkhairedlord
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Re: modern bike maintenance

Postby darkhairedlord » Tue Sep 17, 2019 20:46 pm

kingrollo wrote:
Pilot Pete wrote:Is it in every gear combo, or only when going uphill in low gears? I ask because I’ve just found my creak was not BB but rear cassette! It was only in the lower gears (which are all riveted together on a carrier) when really pushing going uphill. It was a similar sound but nowhere near as loud as yours. Tightened to spec but this was allowing movement, tightened a bit tighter and problem sorted.

PP


Its only when going up steep hills - typically I am in the lower gears when going uphill !!!! - - How do I tighten the rear cassette - or should I purchase a new cassette ?

its been back to kuota - who inspected\removed the bb but found no problems with it - bikes comes back no creaking for a few weeks - then it returns.
took it to lbs - who removed bb and re seated it with some bonding agents - also said they thought the problem was a loose rear through axle - fine for 1st ride - but now creaking again - through axle seems tight enough

in total 3 different people have looked over the bike (shop purchased from, kuota, lbs) all have inspected the BB - on two occasions the bike has come back temporarily cured (once it came back worse - but shop were adamant it wasn't creaking on test ride)

cleats.


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